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Socialism / Collectivism

Posted: Tue Aug 02, 2022 3:15 pm
by bill4long
Do you want to live in a socialist country?

Please define what that means to you.

How much of your income, percentage wise, would you be willing to paying in taxes for a socialist system?

What do you think a fair income tax percentage is?

Do you currenly receive government (taxpayer) monies?

Are you an addict, alcoholic, low IQ, or physically/mentally unable to hold a job?

Just trying to understand. Thanks

Do you love Jimmy Page?

Do you love Eddie Van Halen?

Do you love Steely Dan?

Do you love wild-ass guitarists (I am one) ?

Peace, love, and espectially good lovin' to wild-ass guitarist lovers.

Re: Socialism / Collectivism

Posted: Tue Aug 02, 2022 3:55 pm
by Res Ipsa
bill4long wrote:
Tue Aug 02, 2022 3:15 pm
Do you want to live in a socialist country?

Please define what that means to you.

How much of your income, percentage wise, would you be willing to paying in taxes for a socialist system?

What do you think a fair income tax percentage is?

Do you currenly receive government (taxpayer) monies?

Are you an addict, alcoholic, low IQ, or physically/mentally unable to hold a job?

Just trying to understand. Thanks

Do you love Jimmy Page?

Do you love Eddie Van Halen?

Do you love Steely Dan?

Do you love wild-ass guitarists (I am one) ?

Peace, love, and espectially good lovin' to wild-ass guitarist lovers.
Reversing the order of the first two questions, I use the classic definition of socialism as government ownership of the means of production. So, there is no privately owned business or industry -- only public ownership.

No. I favor a mixed economy. The private market does many things well. The government does many things well. I think it makes sense to apply private ownership and public ownership from a pragmatic standpoint.

Not applicable, as I wouldn't choose to live in a socialist country.

I can't answer the question without context. It depends on how the tax is distributed. It also depends on what the taxpayer is getting from the tax. For example, I think the principle of the graduated income tax is fair. I also think it would be fair to have a higher tax rate if the citizens had access to healthcare on the Canadian model than under the U.S. model.

No.

No, although chronic depression has significantly impacted my ability to earn a living from time to time.

I enjoy Jimmy Page's music.

I enjoy Eddie Van Halen's music.

I really enjoy Steely Dan's music.

I pretty much love it when anyone finds a passion and throws themself into it. That absolutely includes wild ass guitarists.

I'm 100% on board with your last sentence.

Enjoy your day, Bill.

Re: Socialism / Collectivism

Posted: Tue Aug 02, 2022 6:48 pm
by Doctor CamNC4Me
How much of your income, percentage wise, would you be willing to paying in taxes for a socialist system?
Why is it that these guys always demonstrate a level of ignorance about governance and taxation that exceeds any possibility of understanding the system?

‘Wild Ass Guitar Guy’ would do better in life to try and understand something before posting rhetoric and nonsense notions on the Internet (and probably real life).

- Doc

Re: Socialism / Collectivism

Posted: Tue Aug 02, 2022 7:06 pm
by Gadianton
Do you want to live in a socialist country?

Please define what that means to you.
"Socialism" means a terrible society where the government controls everything, takes the labors of the zealous and gives them to the lazy. That's what it means to you, and what it means to every right-winger out there, so the answer is "no", I don't want to live in a socialist country. The fact that you say "socialism / collectivism" tells me you aren't really sure what either term means and they both go together underneath the liberal nightmare. Or am I wrong about that?

Just yesterday on my walk, I ran into a right-wing friend of mine who is older and has trouble getting around. He's faithfully out there on most days doing what he can. He just finished end-of-life care for his wife's mother, and his wife is now to the point where she's not making it very well at home and he's barely mobile himself and so there are some big costs ahead. He's got a reasonable amount of money, but he's not filthy rich. I told him what to tell his children to research in regard to medicaid options and he was eager to get started. I did have to ask him though (we've got a good enough relationship I can give him a hard time) if he knew what the current right-wing objectives were with medicaid and medicare once the red wave takes congress? He isn't sure. Of course not, the only thing I've ever heard him talk about is his gun rights. Every time there's a school shooting, he's in a panic over the government taking away his guns. Looks like Second Amendment is beyond secure at this point, but that's about it, at least he'll be able to protect himself from intruders until the end.

Re: Socialism / Collectivism

Posted: Thu Aug 04, 2022 2:49 pm
by bill4long
Doctor CamNC4Me wrote:
Tue Aug 02, 2022 6:48 pm
Why is it that these guys always demonstrate a level of ignorance about governance and taxation that exceeds any possibility of understanding the system?
It's a simple question. Your answer is just throwing poop.

Re: Socialism / Collectivism

Posted: Fri Aug 05, 2022 12:25 am
by Doctor CamNC4Me
bill4long wrote:
Thu Aug 04, 2022 2:49 pm
Doctor CamNC4Me wrote:
Tue Aug 02, 2022 6:48 pm
Why is it that these guys always demonstrate a level of ignorance about governance and taxation that exceeds any possibility of understanding the system?
It's a simple question. Your answer is just throwing poop.
Why do you care to ask the question?

- Doc

Re: Socialism / Collectivism

Posted: Fri Aug 05, 2022 7:48 am
by Moksha
bill4long wrote:
Tue Aug 02, 2022 3:15 pm
Do you want to live in a socialist country?
I love the idea of public education, roads without tolls, and Japanese-style health care. Taxes taken in need to be roughly equivalent to expenditures going out.

Re: Socialism / Collectivism

Posted: Sun Aug 07, 2022 3:28 am
by Father Francis
Moksha wrote:
Fri Aug 05, 2022 7:48 am
I love the idea of public education, roads without tolls, and Japanese-style health care. Taxes taken in need to be roughly equivalent to expenditures going out.
Bingo.

We all pay taxes, part of the social contract. The other part of that contract is that the people get something back. I often wonder where conservatives think taxes should go, if not to benefit the people

Re: Socialism / Collectivism

Posted: Mon Aug 08, 2022 3:33 pm
by bill4long
Moksha wrote:
Fri Aug 05, 2022 7:48 am
Japanese-style health care.
If they would throw in Comfort Women into the mix it might gain more traction in the USA

Re: Socialism / Collectivism

Posted: Sat Aug 13, 2022 9:03 pm
by huckelberry
Bill,you noted , just trying to understand, and I found myself with an odd bit of the same.

My political views fit well with Res Ipsa explanation.I think all functioning societies are a mix of socialist and private enterprise. People In the US disagree on what government activity the want or want less of .

You asked about receiving government money. I am retired and receive social security. I paid into social security for over fifty years. I think it is a good program.

I get the sense that you are more suspicious of government than I am . I do not know if that goes beyond an old rock song, "I can't drive 55" you know those annoying government driving regulations.

I realize taste is a personal thing and I cannot say which guitarists you should like.I find myself wondering if a noticable difference in taste could reflect other differences. Van Halen is kind of the opposite of what I like. I realize he is skilled enthusiastic and has clear ideas of what he wants to do. Those things mean he is good at playing the guitar. I do not care much to listen. it is a style that puts me off. For wild guitar I prefer Hendrix , Clapton, Buddy Guy even Angus Young. My real preference would be BB King.(or Tony Rice)

I am wondering if this shows me as liberal leaning while you lean conservative? Why would guitar style be a tell?