Bible verse by verse

[Guest]

King James Bible
And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God

All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

So you decide what is evil on the basis of what is contained within the english translation of the original Hebrew version of the Bible and Greek version of the New Testament. I determine what is good based on my in built (learnt or genetic) sense of morals. For instance, the Bible says that killing someone on the basis of an eye for an eye, is okay. My morals tell me that's not okay. The Bible says that if a woman, in defence of her husband against another man, comes into contact with her husband's assailant's private parts then she should be punished (killed? hand cut off? I can't recall exactly). My morals tell me that is not okay. My morals tell me that doing recreational drugs is not okay, what do your scriptures have to say about that?

Romans 3:23
King James Version
For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;

Romans 5:8
New American Standard
But God demonstrates his own love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ died for us.

[_LittleNipper]

Dr. Claude Mariottini – Professor of Old Testament

This blog is a Christian perspective on the Old Testament and Current Events from Dr. Claude Mariottini, Professor of Old Testament at Northern Baptist Seminary.
The Mutilation of Women in the Hebrew Bible
Posted on April 15, 2010 by Claude Mariottini

Please see: http://claudemariottini.com/2010/04/13/ ... -part-1-2/

[_LittleNipper]

Joshua 23:1-16 Long after the Lord had given success to the people of Israel against their enemies and Joshua was very old, he called for the leaders of Israel—the elders, judges, and officers—and said to them that now that he is old and they have seen all that God has done for during Joshua's lifetime. God has fought against Israel's enemies and has given them their land. The land has been divided of both the unconquered and those already destroyed. All the land from the Jordan River to the Mediterranean Sea shall be Israel's.
They are to be very sure to follow all the instructions written in the book of the laws of Moses. They are not to deviate from them the least little bit. They are not to mix with the heathen people still remaining in the land; or mention the names of their gods, much less swear by them or worship them. If Israel begins to intermarry with the nations around them, then know for a certainty that the Lord will no longer chase those nations from the land. Instead, they will be a snare and a trap, a pain in the side and a thorn in the eyes. Israel will disappear from this good land which the Lord has provided. Joshua says that he is soon to die. The Lord has given the good things he promised, just as certainly he will bring evil if disobeyed.

Young's Literal Translation (YLT)
1 And it cometh to pass, many days after that Jehovah hath given rest to Israel from all their enemies round about, that Joshua is old, entering into days,

2 and Joshua calleth for all Israel, for its elders, and for its heads, and for its judges, and for its authorities, and saith unto them, `I have become old; I have entered into days;

3 and ye -- ye have seen all that Jehovah your God hath done to all these nations because of you, for Jehovah your God [is] He who is fighting for you;

4 see, I have caused to fall to you these nations who are left for an inheritance to your tribes, from the Jordan, (and all the nations which I cut off), and the great sea, the going in of the sun.

5 `As to Jehovah your God, He doth thrust them from your presence, and hath dispossessed them from before you, and ye have possessed their land, as Jehovah your God hath spoken to you,

6 and ye have been very strong to keep and to do the whole that is written in the Book of the Law of Moses, so as not to turn aside from it right or left,

7 so as not to go in among these nations, these who are left with you; and of the name of their gods ye do not make mention, nor do ye swear, nor do ye serve them, nor do ye bow yourselves to them;

8 but to Jehovah your God ye do cleave, as ye have done till this day.

9 And Jehovah is dispossessing from before you nations great and mighty; as for you, none hath stood in your presence till this day;

10 one man of you doth pursue a thousand, for Jehovah your God [is] He who is fighting for you, as He hath spoken to you;

11 and ye have been very watchful for yourselves to love Jehovah your God.

12 `But -- if ye at all turn back and have cleaved to the remnant of these nations, these who are left with you, and intermarried with them, and gone in to them, and they to you,

13 know certainly that Jehovah your God is not continuing to dispossess these nations from before you, and they have been to you for a gin, and for a snare, and for a scourge, in your sides, and for thorns in your eyes, till ye perish from off this good ground which Jehovah your God hath given to you.

14 `And lo, I am going, to-day, in the way of all the earth, and ye have known -- with all your heart, and with all your soul -- that there hath not fallen one thing of all the good things which Jehovah your God hath spoken concerning you; the whole have come to you; there hath not failed of it one thing.

15 `And it hath been, as there hath come upon you all the good thing which Jehovah your God hath spoken unto you, so doth Jehovah bring upon you the whole of the evil thing, till His destroying you from off this good ground which Jehovah your God hath given to you;

16 in your transgressing the covenant of Jehovah your God which He commanded you, and ye have gone and served other gods, and bowed yourselves to them, then hath the anger of Jehovah burned against you, and ye have perished hastily from off the good land which He hath given to you.'

[_Bazooka]

So you decide what is evil on the basis of what is contained within the english translation of the original Hebrew version of the Bible and Greek version of the New Testament. I determine what is good based on my in built (learnt or genetic) sense of morals. For instance, the Bible says that killing someone on the basis of an eye for an eye, is okay. My morals tell me that's not okay. The Bible says that if a woman, in defence of her husband against another man, comes into contact with her husband's assailant's private parts then she should be punished (killed? hand cut off? I can't recall exactly). My morals tell me that is not okay. My morals tell me that doing recreational drugs is not okay, what do your scriptures have to say about that?

Romans 3:23
King James Version
For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;

Romans 5:8
New American Standard
But God demonstrates his own love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ died for us.

I'm sure you think your post responds to mine, but I'm really struggling to see how.....

[_Ludd]

I believe you are arguing from your conclusion.

You believe that God created everything (i.e., space and matter) from nothing.

Hence, when you read the Genesis creation account, that is what you interpret.

But that is not what it says . . .


All the Best!

--Consiglieri

I do use the Bible to understand the Bible. I will give you one verse (at this time) to prove what I say is an honest assessment. As we go through the Bible more will come. See Colossians 1:16

New International Version (©1984)
For by him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things were created by him and for him.

New Living Translation (©2007)
for through him God created everything in the heavenly realms and on earth. He made the things we can see and the things we can't see--such as thrones, kingdoms, rulers, and authorities in the unseen world. Everything was created through him and for him.

English Standard Version (©2001)
For by him all things were created, in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things were created through him and for him.

New American Standard Bible (©1995)
For by Him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities-- all things have been created through Him and for Him.

King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.)
For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

International Standard Version (©2008)
For by him all things in heaven and on earth were created, things visible and invisible, whether they are kings, lords, rulers, or powers. All things have been created through him and for him.

Aramaic Bible in Plain English (©2010)
By him was everything created which is in Heaven and in The Earth: everything that is seen and everything that is unseen, whether Thrones or Dominions or Principalities or Rulers; everything has been created by his hand and in him.

GOD'S WORD® Translation (©1995)
He created all things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible. Whether they are kings or lords, rulers or powers- everything has been created through him and for him.

King James 2000 Bible (©2003)
For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

American King James Version
For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

American Standard Version
for in him were all things created, in the heavens and upon the earth, things visible and things invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers; all things have been created through him, and unto him;

Douay-Rheims Bible
For in him were all things created in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones, or dominations, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him and in him.

Darby Bible Translation
because by him were created all things, the things in the heavens and the things upon the earth, the visible and the invisible, whether thrones, or lordships, or principalities, or authorities: all things have been created by him and for him.

English Revised Version
for in him were all things created, in the heavens and upon the earth, things visible and things invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers; all things have been created through him, and unto him;

Webster's Bible Translation
For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are upon earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

Weymouth New Testament
For in Him was created the universe of things in heaven and on earth, things seen and things unseen, thrones, dominions, princedoms, powers--all were created, and exist through and for Him.

World English Bible
For by him all things were created, in the heavens and on the earth, things visible and things invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers; all things have been created through him, and for him.

Young's Literal Translation
because in him were the all things created, those in the heavens, and those upon the earth, those visible, and those invisible, whether thrones, whether lordships, whether principalities, whether authorities; all things through him, and for him, have been created,

Wow! What a thread. I just barely noticed it today. Only got to page 3 before I realized I wasn't much interested in reading anymore of it. However, I did want to at least make note that what you think is a rebutal of consiglieri's comment, is not. At least not in my view.

The verses you quote from Collossians all say pretty much the same thing: "For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth ..." .

Well, consiglier's argument is that the Bible doesn't say god created the heavens and the earth. And your quotes from Collossians just says that god created all things that "are in heaven, and that are in earth". So we're left with the idea that "heaven" and "earth" were already there, and that god went about creating things "in" them. That seems to corrborate exactly what consiglieri was saying.

So your creatio ex nihilo argument is only made weaker by you trying to use Collossians to support it. In fact, Collossians appears to very clearly argue against the whole "creation out of nothing" idea.

Anyway, that's all I have to say about your mega-thread, other than I think you probably didn't think things through very much when you decided to come on this forum and start preaching EV-style Bible interpretation. Haven't you noticed that there aren't very many people on this board who even believe the Bible is worth taking seriously about anything?

[_LittleNipper]

I do use the Bible to understand the Bible. I will give you one verse (at this time) to prove what I say is an honest assessment. As we go through the Bible more will come. See Colossians 1:16

New International Version (©1984)
For by him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things were created by him and for him.

New Living Translation (©2007)
for through him God created everything in the heavenly realms and on earth. He made the things we can see and the things we can't see--such as thrones, kingdoms, rulers, and authorities in the unseen world. Everything was created through him and for him.

English Standard Version (©2001)
For by him all things were created, in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things were created through him and for him.

New American Standard Bible (©1995)
For by Him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities-- all things have been created through Him and for Him.

King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.)
For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

International Standard Version (©2008)
For by him all things in heaven and on earth were created, things visible and invisible, whether they are kings, lords, rulers, or powers. All things have been created through him and for him.

Aramaic Bible in Plain English (©2010)
By him was everything created which is in Heaven and in The Earth: everything that is seen and everything that is unseen, whether Thrones or Dominions or Principalities or Rulers; everything has been created by his hand and in him.

GOD'S WORD® Translation (©1995)
He created all things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible. Whether they are kings or lords, rulers or powers- everything has been created through him and for him.

King James 2000 Bible (©2003)
For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

American King James Version
For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

American Standard Version
for in him were all things created, in the heavens and upon the earth, things visible and things invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers; all things have been created through him, and unto him;

Douay-Rheims Bible
For in him were all things created in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones, or dominations, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him and in him.

Darby Bible Translation
because by him were created all things, the things in the heavens and the things upon the earth, the visible and the invisible, whether thrones, or lordships, or principalities, or authorities: all things have been created by him and for him.

English Revised Version
for in him were all things created, in the heavens and upon the earth, things visible and things invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers; all things have been created through him, and unto him;

Webster's Bible Translation
For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are upon earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

Weymouth New Testament
For in Him was created the universe of things in heaven and on earth, things seen and things unseen, thrones, dominions, princedoms, powers--all were created, and exist through and for Him.

World English Bible
For by him all things were created, in the heavens and on the earth, things visible and things invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers; all things have been created through him, and for him.

Young's Literal Translation
because in him were the all things created, those in the heavens, and those upon the earth, those visible, and those invisible, whether thrones, whether lordships, whether principalities, whether authorities; all things through him, and for him, have been created,

Wow! What a thread. I just barely noticed it today. Only got to page 3 before I realized I wasn't much interested in reading anymore of it. However, I did want to at least make note that what you think is a rebutal of consiglieri's comment, is not. At least not in my view.

The verses you quote from Collossians all say pretty much the same thing: "For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth ..." .

Well, consiglier's argument is that the Bible doesn't say god created the heavens and the earth. And your quotes from Collossians just says that god created all things that "are in heaven, and that are in earth". So we're left with the idea that "heaven" and "earth" were already there, and that god went about creating things "in" them. That seems to corrborate exactly what consiglieri was saying.

So your creatio ex nihilo argument is only made weaker by you trying to use Collossians to support it. In fact, Collossians appears to very clearly argue against the whole "creation out of nothing" idea.

Anyway, that's all I have to say about your mega-thread, other than I think you probably didn't think things through very much when you decided to come on this forum and start preaching EV-style Bible interpretation. Haven't you noticed that there aren't very many people on this board who even believe the Bible is worth taking seriously about anything?

Well, It says all things were created by God. Everything that's visible and invisible. So God created everything. But for the sake of an argument consider Heb. 11:3, “Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.”

[_LittleNipper]

Romans 3:23
King James Version
For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;

Romans 5:8
New American Standard
But God demonstrates his own love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ died for us.

I'm sure you think your post responds to mine, but I'm really struggling to see how.....

God cares for people who are sinners. So, the idea that God is immoral is totally an odd position to me. I am sure God cares for people who care, and people who don't care, God tries to win them over--- but at some point ignores them. When they become just stumbling blocks to others who may or will care, God takes them out of the way.

[_Bazooka]

How did God care for the filippinos killed in the recent storm?

[_LittleNipper]

How did God care for the filippinos killed in the recent storm?

He didn't allow the island to sink.

[_ludwigm]

How did God care for the filippinos killed in the recent storm?

He didn't allow the island to sink.

I remember the story about Stalin's goodness.
He has ordered off the vociferous children from his window.

He might have ordered them to be shot, as well.



(by the way I am not certain about using the proper tense...)