Bible verse by verse

[_Bazooka]

How did God care for the filippinos killed in the recent storm?

He didn't allow the island to sink.

How did that help the filippino's who were killed?

[_LittleNipper]

How did God care for the filippinos killed in the recent storm? How did that help the filippino's who were killed?

Hebrews 9:27 BBE
Bible in Basic English

...because by God's law death comes to men once, and after that they are judged;

[_Bazooka]

How did God care for the filippinos killed in the recent storm? How did that help the filippino's who were killed?

Hebrews 9:27 BBE
Bible in Basic English

...because by God's law death comes to men once, and after that they are judged;

Again, your post doesn't seem to relate to my question.
Unless you are suggesting that God helped them by taking them away from their weather stricken family in order that He could judge them....but you'd need to explain specifically how letting them die 'early' leaving their families behind to fend without them in exceptionally difficult circumstances constitutes 'help'.

[_subgenius]

How did that help the filippino's who were killed?

how did it not help?...help with what, exactly?

your fundamental flaw is always revealed when you insist that God's will must be in line with your own...that your reasons must somehow supersede, or outweigh, those of God.
That somehow if you are not given the "reason" for God's actions then those actions must somehow be subject to your judgment...and oh what a pristine and admirable judgment that must be.

So...exactly how do you discern from the whole of scriptures that:
1. God is beholden to you, or any person, in providing cause for His actions?
2. God's "care" is manifest by the preservation/destruction of life and/or property?

[_LittleNipper]

Again, your post doesn't seem to relate to my question.
Unless you are suggesting that God helped them by taking them away from their weather stricken family in order that He could judge them....but you'd need to explain specifically how letting them die 'early' leaving their families behind to fend without them in exceptionally difficult circumstances constitutes 'help'.

Well, your question doesn't relate to the thread. You explain how a sinful world could possibly be perfect.

[_LittleNipper]

Joshua 24:1-33 Joshua summoned all the people of Israel to him at Shechem. They all came and presented themselves before God. Joshua tells them that their ancestors, including Terah the father of Abraham and Nahor, who lived east of the Euphrates River; worshipped other gods. God took father Abraham from that land across the river and led him into the land of Canaan and gave him many descendants: Isaac, his son, Jacob and Esau----his grandchildren. To Esau God gave the area around Mount Seir while Jacob and his children went into Egypt.

God sent Moses and Aaron to bring terrible plagues upon Egypt; and afterwards brought His people out as free men. When they arrived at the Red Sea, the Egyptians chased after them with chariots and cavalry. Israel cried out to God and I put darkness between them and the Egyptians; and brought the sea crashing in upon the Egyptians, drowning them. Then Israel lived in the wilderness for a long time. Finally God brought Israel into the land of the Amorites on the other side of the Jordan; fighting against Israel, God destroyed them and gave Israel their land. King Balak of Moab started a war against Israel, and asked Balaam, the son of Beor, to curse Israel. But God wouldn’t listen to him. Instead God made Balaam to bless Israel.

Israel crossed the Jordan River and came to Jericho. The men of Jericho fought and so did many others—the Perizzites, the Canaanites, the Hittites, the Girgashites, the Hivites, and the Jebusites. Each in turn fought but God destroyed them all. God send hornets to drive out the two kings of the Amorite -- not by Israel's sword or bow. God provided land they had not worked for and cities they did not build. God provided vineyards and olive groves for food, that Israel did not plant. Israel is to revere Jehovah and serve him in sincerity and truth. They must put away forever the idols their ancestors worshiped when they lived beyond the Euphrates River and in Egypt. Worship the Lord alone. They decide today whom they will obey. Will it be the gods of their ancestors beyond the Euphrates or the gods of the Amorites here in this land?

The people replied, “We would never forsake the Lord and worship other gods! The Lord our God is the one who rescued our fathers from their slavery in the land of Egypt. He is the God who did mighty miracles before the eyes of Israel, as we traveled through the wilderness, and preserved us from our enemies when we passed through their land. It was the Lord who drove out the Amorites and the other nations living here in the land. Yes, we choose the Lord, for he alone is our God.”

Joshua replied to the people, “You can’t worship the Lord God, for he is holy and jealous; he will not forgive your rebellion and sins. If you forsake him and worship other gods, he will turn upon you and destroy you, even though he has taken care of you for such a long time.”

But the people picked the Lord. Joshua ordered them to destroy all the idols they own, and must obey the Lord God of Israel. So Joshua made a covenant with them that day at Shechem, committing them to a permanent and binding contract between themselves and God. Joshua recorded the people’s reply in the book of the laws of God and took a huge stone as a reminder and rolled it beneath the oak tree that was beside the Tabernacle. Joshua said to all the people, “This stone has heard everything the Lord said, so it will be a witness to testify against you if you go back on your word.” Joshua sent the people away to their own sections of the country. Shortly after this he died at the age of 110, and was buried on his own estate at Timnath-serah, in the hill country of Ephraim, on the north side of the mountains of Gaash. Israel obeyed the Lord throughout the lifetimes of Joshua and the other old men who had personally witnessed the amazing deeds the Lord had done for Israel. The bones of Joseph, which the people of Israel had brought along when they left Egypt, were buried in Shechem, in the parcel of ground Jacob had bought from the sons of Hamor. (In the land assigned to the tribes of Joseph.) Eleazar, the son of Aaron, also died and was buried in the hill country of Ephraim, at the city of Gibeah, given to his son Phinehas.


Young's Literal Translation (YLT)


1 And Joshua gathereth all the tribes of Israel to Shechem, and calleth for the elders of Israel, and for its heads, and for its judges, and for its authorities, and they station themselves before God.

2 And Joshua saith unto all the people, `Thus said Jehovah, God of Israel, Beyond the River have your fathers dwelt of old -- Terah father of Abraham and father of Nachor -- and they serve other gods;

3 and I take your father Abraham from beyond the River, and cause him to go through all the land of Canaan, and multiply his seed, and give to him Isaac.

4 And I give to Isaac, Jacob and Esau; and I give to Esau mount Seir, to possess it; and Jacob and his sons have gone down to Egypt.

5 And I send Moses and Aaron, and plague Egypt, as I have done in its midst, and afterwards I have brought you out.

6 And I bring out your fathers from Egypt, and ye go into the sea, and the Egyptians pursue after your fathers, with chariot and with horsemen, to the Red Sea;

7 and they cry unto Jehovah, and He setteth thick darkness between you and the Egyptians, and bringeth on them the sea, and covereth them, and your eyes see that which I have done in Egypt; and ye dwell in a wilderness many days.

8 `And I bring you in unto the land of the Amorite who is dwelling beyond the Jordan, and they fight with you, and I give them into your hand, and ye possess their land, and I destroy them out of your presence.

9 `And Balak son of Zippor, king of Moab, riseth and fighteth against Israel, and sendeth and calleth for Balaam son of Beor, to revile you,

10 and I have not been willing to hearken to Balaam, and he doth greatly bless you, and I deliver you out of his hand.

11 `And ye pass over the Jordan, and come in unto Jericho, and fight against you do the possessors of Jericho -- the Amorite, and the Perizzite, and the Canaanite, and the Hittite, and the Girgashite, the Hivite, and the Jebusite -- and I give them into your hand.

12 And I send before you the hornet, and it casteth them out from your presence -- two kings of the Amorite -- not by thy sword, nor by thy bow.

13 `And I give to you a land for which thou hast not laboured, and cities which ye have not built, and ye dwell in them; of vineyards and olive-yards which ye have not planted ye are eating.

14 `And now, fear ye Jehovah, and serve Him, in perfection and in truth, and turn aside the gods which your fathers served beyond the River, and in Egypt, and serve ye Jehovah;

15 and if wrong in your eyes to serve Jehovah -- choose for you to-day whom ye do serve; -- whether the gods whom your fathers served, which [are] beyond the River, or the gods of the Amorite in whose land ye are dwelling; and I and my house -- we serve Jehovah.'

16 And the people answer and say, `Far be it from us to forsake Jehovah, to serve other gods;

17 for Jehovah our God [is] He who is bringing us and our fathers up out of the land of Egypt, out of a house of servants, and who hath done before our eyes these great signs, and doth keep us in all the way in which we have gone, and among all the peoples through whose midst we passed;

18 and Jehovah casteth out the whole of the peoples, even the Amorite inhabiting the land, from our presence; we also do serve Jehovah, for He [is] our God.'

19 And Joshua saith unto the people, `Ye are not able to serve Jehovah, for a God most holy He [is]; a zealous God He [is]; He doth not bear with your transgression and with your sins.

20 When ye forsake Jehovah, and have served gods of a stranger, then He hath turned back and done evil to you, and consumed you, after that He hath done good to you.'

21 And the people saith unto Joshua, `No, but Jehovah we do serve.'

22 And Joshua saith unto the people, `Witnesses ye are against yourselves, that ye have chosen for you Jehovah to serve Him (and they say, `Witnesses!')

23 and, now, turn aside the gods of the stranger which [are] in your midst, and incline your heart unto Jehovah, God of Israel.'

24 And the people say unto Joshua, `Jehovah our God we serve, and to His voice we hearken.'

25 And Joshua maketh a covenant with the people on that day, and layeth on it a statute and an ordinance, in Shechem.

26 And Joshua writeth these words in the Book of the Law of God, and taketh a great stone, and raiseth it up there under the oak which [is] in the sanctuary of Jehovah.

27 And Joshua saith unto all the people, `Lo, this stone is against us for a witness, for it hath heard all the sayings of Jehovah which He hath spoken with us, and it hath been against you for a witness, lest ye lie against your God.'

28 And Joshua sendeth the people away, each to his inheritance.

29 And it cometh to pass, after these things, that Joshua son of Nun, servant of Jehovah, dieth, a son of a hundred and ten years,

30 and they bury him in the border of his inheritance, in Timnath-Serah, which [is] in the hill-country of Ephraim, on the north of the hill of Gaash.

31 And Israel serveth Jehovah all the days of Joshua, and all the days of the elders who prolonged days after Joshua, and who knew all the work of Jehovah which He did to Israel.

32 And the bones of Joseph, which the sons of Israel brought up out of Egypt, they buried in Shechem, in the portion of the field which Jacob bought from the sons of Hamor father of Shechem, with a hundred kesitah; and they are to the sons of Joseph for an inheritance.

33 And Eleazar son of Aaron died, and they bury him in the hill of Phinehas his son, which was given to him in the hill-country of Ephraim.

[_Gunnar]

How did that help the filippino's who were killed?

how did it not help?...help with what, exactly?

your fundamental flaw is always revealed when you insist that God's will must be in line with your own...that your reasons must somehow supersede, or outweigh, those of God.
That somehow if you are not given the "reason" for God's actions then those actions must somehow be subject to your judgment...and oh what a pristine and admirable judgment that must be.

So...exactly how do you discern from the whole of scriptures that:
1. God is beholden to you, or any person, in providing cause for His actions?
2. God's "care" is manifest by the preservation/destruction of life and/or property?

Your and LittleNipper's fundamental flaw is that neither of you is willing to seriously consider the possibility that you could be mistaken about God and what or even whether He has ever actually revealed anything to you, let alone agree with each other on what God has or has not revealed. Please refer again to my signature line.

[_Gunnar]

Again, your post doesn't seem to relate to my question.
Unless you are suggesting that God helped them by taking them away from their weather stricken family in order that He could judge them....but you'd need to explain specifically how letting them die 'early' leaving their families behind to fend without them in exceptionally difficult circumstances constitutes 'help'.

Well, your question doesn't relate to the thread. You explain how a sinful world could possibly be perfect.

That depends on one's definitions of "perfect" and "sinful" doesn't it? Can you give us universally accepted or uncontroversial definitions of those terms?

And here is a question you have apparently not even tried to address, though I have asked it of you more than once: How could God be truly omnipotent or competent if the entire, incredibly vast Universe he supposedly created could have become so easily corrupted by the single act of one human being on this world, which is such an infinitesimally tiny portion of all that exists?

A related question is this: What is so incredibly sinful about seeking knowledge? That was, after all, the motivation for Adam and Eve to partake of the fruit in the first place, wasn't it?

[_Bazooka]

Again, your post doesn't seem to relate to my question.
Unless you are suggesting that God helped them by taking them away from their weather stricken family in order that He could judge them....but you'd need to explain specifically how letting them die 'early' leaving their families behind to fend without them in exceptionally difficult circumstances constitutes 'help'.

Well, your question doesn't relate to the thread. You explain how a sinful world could possibly be perfect.

Back in the kindergarten debating club I see....

Why do I need to explain how a sinful world could possibly be perfect when I haven't made such a claim?

Are you conceding that you cannot explain how God taking those poor unfortunate Filipino people to be judged constitutes helping them?

[_Bazooka]

how did it not help?...help with what, exactly?

If you feel the need to interject like this please ensure you've kept up with the conversation.

your fundamental flaw is always revealed when you insist that God's will must be in line with your own...that your reasons must somehow supersede, or outweigh, those of God.

In which case you will be able to show me where I have insisted that God's will be in line with my own.

That somehow if you are not given the "reason" for God's actions then those actions must somehow be subject to your judgment...and oh what a pristine and admirable judgment that must be.

Isn't religion all about giving the perceived reasons for God's actions?
I'm challenging those (Nippers) perceptions, not God.

So...exactly how do you discern from the whole of scriptures that:
1. God is beholden to you, or any person, in providing cause for His actions?
2. God's "care" is manifest by the preservation/destruction of life and/or property?

Thanks for showing that you haven't kept up with the conversation on this thread.
You really don't know who said what and why.
Please go back and reread the relevant parts of the thread.

However, do you think God is not beholden to humanity to give explanation about what He has or hasn't done and why?
I think you will find that Mormonism teaches that He is - it's called making covenants (two way agreements).
He (supposedly) sent us down to earth to learn. How do you learn without asking questions and forming judgements on what you perceive are the answers?
The primary purpose for being on earth (supposedly) is to 'judge' for ones self.