Bible verse by verse

[_ludwigm]

Hi, Ludwig.

Yes, I am here.

And I am Hungarian.

[_Bazooka]

A post modern generation invented "Harry Potter," to fill the void they themselves have opened. Potter is quite an inferior character in a discussion concerning GOD. The realty is that you cover up your philosophical "rationalizations" by interjections of the absurd. Such frivolity does nothing to support your position.

Inferior?
Potter defeated his adversary face to face.
Your God let's His minions tackle (unsuccessfully) the fight against Satan.

[_The Erotic Apologist]

Inferior?
Potter defeated his adversary face to face.
Your God let's His minions tackle (unsuccessfully) the fight against Satan.

Yes, that too! And unlike Yahweh, Harry Potter isn't obsessed with foreskins and menstrual blood.

[_LittleNipper]

That's because you still don't know anything about Chinese ideograms other than what you cut-and-paste (often without proper attribution) from apologetic sites. Go take a couple years worth of university-level Chinese courses while simultaneously living in China and you'll understand exactly how little you know at this point in time.

Again, this is a wonderful example of why you should do your own research instead of simply cutting-and-pasting blocks of text from wacky religious sites

Don't believe me, believe Christian Chinese. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BmK65_kEjKA
Show me Christian Chinese who agree with you.

[Guest]

A post modern generation invented "Harry Potter," to fill the void they themselves have opened. Potter is quite an inferior character in a discussion concerning GOD. The realty is that you cover up your philosophical "rationalizations" by interjections of the absurd. Such frivolity does nothing to support your position.

Inferior?
Potter defeated his adversary face to face.
Your God let's His minions tackle (unsuccessfully) the fight against Satan.

Jesus confronted the adversary and went to the cross Himself. He also arose from the dead.

[_LittleNipper]

1 Kings 14:1-31 Jeroboam’s son named Abijah became very sick. Jeroboam told his wife, “Disguise yourself so that no one will recognize you as the queen, and go to Ahijah the prophet at Shiloh—the man who told me that I would become king. Take him a gift of ten loaves of bread, some fig bars, and a jar of honey, and ask him whether the boy will recover.”

Jeroboam's wife went to Ahijah’s home at Shiloh. He had become an old man and was blind. The Lord told him that the queen, pretending to be someone else, would come to ask about her son, for he was very sick. And the Lord told him what to say. When Ahijah heard her at the door, he called out, “Come in, wife of Jeroboam! Why are you pretending to be someone else?”

Then he told her, “I have sad news for you. Give your husband this message from the Lord God of Israel: ‘I promoted you from the ranks of the common people and made you king of Israel. I ripped the kingdom away from the family of David and gave it to you, but you have not obeyed my commandments as my servant David did. His heart’s desire was always to obey me and to do whatever I wanted him to. But you have done more evil than all the other kings before you; you have made other gods and have made me furious with your gold calves. And since you have refused to acknowledge me, I will bring disaster upon your home and will destroy all of your sons—this boy who is sick and all those who are well. I will sweep away your family as a stable hand shovels out manure. I vow that those of your family who die in the city shall be eaten by dogs, and those who die in the field shall be eaten by birds.’”

Ahijah told Jeroboam’s wife to go home, and when she returns, the child will die. All of Israel will mourn for him and bury him, but he is the only member of the family who will come to a quiet end. This child is the only good thing that the Lord God of Israel sees in the entire family of Jeroboam. And the Lord will raise up a king over Israel who will destroy Jeroboam. The Lord will shake Israel like a reed whipped about in a stream; the people of Israel will be uprooted from this good land of their fathers and scatter them beyond the Euphrates River, for they have angered the Lord by worshiping false gods.

Jeroboam’s wife returned to Tirzah; and the child died just as she walked through the door of her home. And there was mourning for him throughout the land, just as the Lord had predicted through Ahijah. The rest of Jeroboam’s activities—his wars and the other events of his reign—are recorded in The Annals of the Kings of Israel. Jeroboam reigned twenty-two years, and when he died, his son Nadab took the throne.

Rehoboam the son of Solomon was king in Judah. He was 41 years old when he began to reign, and he was on the throne 17 years in Jerusalem, the city which, among all the cities of Israel, the Lord had chosen to live in. (Rehoboam’s mother was Naamah, an Ammonite woman.) During his reign the people of Judah, like those in Israel, did wrong and angered the Lord with their sin, for it was even worse than that of their ancestors. They also built shrines and obelisks and idols on every high hill and under every green tree. There was ramped sexual deviation throughout the land, and the people of Judah became as depraved as the heathen nations which the Lord drove out to make room for his people.

In the 5 year of Rehoboam’s reign, King Shishak of Egypt attacked and conquered Jerusalem. He ransacked the Temple and the palace and stole everything, including all the gold shields Solomon had made. Afterwards Rehoboam made bronze shields as substitutes, and the palace guards used these instead. Whenever the king went to the Temple, the guards paraded before him and then took the shields back to the guard chamber. The other events in Rehoboam’s reign are written in The Chronicles of the kings of Judah . There was constant war between Rehoboam and Jeroboam. When Rehoboam died—his mother was Naamah the Ammonitess—he was buried among his ancestors in Jerusalem, and his son Abijam took the throne.


Young's Literal Translation (YLT)


1 At that time was Abijah son of Jeroboam sick,

2 and Jeroboam saith to his wife, `Rise, I pray thee, and change thyself, and they know not that thou [art] wife of Jeroboam, and thou hast gone to Shiloh; lo, there [is] Ahijah the prophet; he spake unto me of [being] king over this people;

3 and thou hast taken in thy hand ten loaves, and crumbs, and a bottle of honey, and hast gone in unto him; he doth declare to thee what becometh of the youth.'

4 And the wife of Jeroboam doth so, and riseth, and goeth to Shiloh, and entereth the house of Ahijah, and Ahijah is not able to see, for his eyes have stood because of his age.

5 And Jehovah said unto Ahijah, `Lo, the wife of Jeroboam is coming to seek a word from thee concerning her son, for he is sick; thus and thus thou dost speak unto her, and it cometh to pass at her coming in, that she is making herself strange.'

6 And it cometh to pass, at Ahijah's hearing the sound of her feet [as] she came in to the opening, that he saith, `Come in, wife of Jeroboam, why is this -- thou art making thyself strange? and I am sent unto thee [with] a sharp thing:

7 Go, say to Jeroboam, Thus said Jehovah, God of Israel, Because that I have made thee high out of the midst of the people, and appoint thee leader over my people Israel,

8 and rend the kingdom from the house of David, and give it to thee, -- and thou hast not been as My servant David who kept My commands, and who walked after Me with all his heart, to do only that which [is] right in Mine eyes,

9 and thou dost evil above all who have been before thee, and goest, and makest to thee other gods and molten images to provoke Me to anger, and Me thou hast cast behind thy back:

10 `Therefore, lo, I am bringing in evil unto the house of Jeroboam, and have cut off to Jeroboam those sitting on the wall -- shut up and left -- in Israel, and have put away the posterity of the house of Jeroboam, as one putteth away the dung till its consumption;

11 him who dieth of Jeroboam in a city do the dogs eat, and him who dieth in a field do fowl of the heavens eat, for Jehovah hath spoken.

12 `And thou, rise, go to thy house; in the going in of thy feet to the city -- hath the lad died;

13 and all Israel have mourned for him, and buried him, for this one -- by himself -- cometh of Jeroboam unto a grave, because there hath been found in him a good thing towards Jehovah, God of Israel, in the house of Jeroboam.

14 `And Jehovah hath raised up for Him a king over Israel who cutteth off the house of Jeroboam this day -- and what? -- even now!

15 And Jehovah hath smitten Israel as the reed is moved by the waters, and hath plucked Israel from off this good ground that He gave to their fathers, and scattered them beyond the River, because that they made their shrines, provoking Jehovah to anger;

16 and He giveth up Israel because of the sins of Jeroboam that he sinned, and that he caused Israel to sin.'

17 And the wife of Jeroboam riseth, and goeth, and cometh to Tirzah; she hath come in to the threshold of the house, and the youth dieth;

18 and they bury him, and mourn for him do all Israel, according to the word of Jehovah, that he spake by the hand of His servant Ahijah the prophet.

19 And the rest of the matters of Jeroboam, how he fought, and how he reigned, lo, they are written on the book of the Chronicles of the kings of Israel.

20 And the days that Jeroboam reigned [are] twenty and two years, and he lieth with his fathers, and reign doth Nadab his son in his stead.

21 And Rehoboam son of Solomon hath reigned in Judah; a son of forty and one years [is] Rehoboam in his reigning, and seventeen years he hath reigned in Jerusalem, the city that Jehovah chose to set His name there, out of all the tribes of Israel, and the name of his mother [is] Naamah the Ammonitess.

22 And Judah doth the evil thing in the eyes of Jehovah, and they make Him zealous above all that their fathers did by their sins that they have sinned.

23 And they build -- also they -- for themselves high places, and standing-pillars, and shrines, on every high height, and under every green tree;

24 and also a whoremonger hath been in the land; they have done according to all the abominations of the nations that Jehovah dispossessed from the presence of the sons of Israel.

25 And it cometh to pass, in the fifth year of king Rehoboam, gone up hath Shishak king of Egypt against Jerusalem,

26 and he taketh the treasures of the house of Jehovah, and the treasures of the house of the king, yea, the whole he hath taken; and he taketh all the shields of gold that Solomon made.

27 And king Rehoboam maketh in their stead shields of brass, and hath made [them] a charge on the hand of the heads of the runners, those keeping the opening of the house of the king,

28 and it cometh to pass, from the going in of the king to the house of Jehovah, the runners bear them, and have brought them back unto the chamber of the runners.

29 And the rest of the matters of Rehoboam, and all that he did, are they not written on the book of the Chronicles of the kings of Judah?

30 And war hath been between Rehoboam and Jeroboam all the days;

31 and Rehoboam lieth with his fathers, and is buried with his fathers, in the city of David, and the name of his mother [is] Naamah the Ammonitess, and reign doth Abijam his son in his stead.

[_The Erotic Apologist]

Don't believe me, believe Christian Chinese. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BmK65_kEjKA

Sigh...the dude in this video makes all the same mistakes that all the other apologetic sites make. In short, he treats semantic-phonetic compound elements as though they are compound-indicative. You probably have no idea what this means because you've never sat down and studied it, which is why you're forced to cut-and-paste other peoples' words. This really hurts your credibility. It also begs the question of whether you're capable of independent thought.

You're also overlooking the fact that many native-born Chinese speakers have never formally studied the origins of Chinese ideograms--in exactly the same way that many native-born English speakers have never formally studied Latin. In other words, the fact that someone happens to be a Chinese Christian doesn't automatically mean they're a Chinese scholar. It's rather dishonest of you to conflate a Chinese Christian to the level of a Classical Chinese scholar solely on the basis of religion. Do you honestly think you won't get caught when you do stupid stuff like that?

Show me Christian Chinese who agree with you.

That's just silly. That's like me asking you to show me an atheist who believes Christ rose from the dead.

[_LittleNipper]

Don't believe me, believe Christian Chinese. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BmK65_kEjKA

Sigh...the dude in this video makes all the same mistakes that all the other apologetic sites make. In short, he treats semantic-phonetic compound elements as though they are compound-indicative. You probably have no idea what this means because you've never sat down and studied it, which is why you're forced to cut-and-paste other peoples' words. This really hurts your credibility. It also begs the question of whether you're capable of independent thought.

You're also overlooking the fact that many native-born Chinese speakers have never formally studied the origins of Chinese ideograms--in exactly the same way that many native-born English speakers have never formally studied Latin. In other words, the fact that someone happens to be a Chinese Christian doesn't automatically mean they're a Chinese scholar. It's rather dishonest of you to conflate a Chinese Christian to the level of a Classical Chinese scholar solely on the basis of religion. Do you honestly think you won't get caught when you do stupid stuff like that?

Show me Christian Chinese who agree with you.

That's just silly. That's like me asking you to show me an atheist who believes Christ rose from the dead.

Not exactly!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Some "Christians" don't believe that the Genesis creation and the Flood record are literal. There should be Christian Chinese linguists that disagree with what I accept from the very learned Chinese Christian scholar. And I would imagine that he would know more about the Chinese language than most western atheists. It is dishonest of you to imply that this man is wrong because he disagrees with what you learned from those who have every desire to disparage Christ at every opportunity. And you don't want to see, that coincidence after coincidence (regarding not just a few ancient Chinese characters) doesn't amount to the likely conclusion that there is much more going on than you care to accept. Yet, you will accept evolution based on far less circumstantial evidence.....

[_The Erotic Apologist]

Not exactly!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Some "Christians" don't believe that the Genesis creation and the Flood record are literal.

Probably because they're not.

There should be Christian Chinese linguists that disagree with what I accept from the very learned Chinese Christian scholar.

You mean the English-speaking minister who isn't fluent in Mandarin, and who therefore needs a Mandarin-speaking interpreter in order to address a Mandarin audience? Whatever...

And I would imagine that he would know more about the Chinese language than most western atheists.

Yeah, because imagination is all you have to go on at this point.

It is dishonest of you to imply that this man is wrong because he disagrees with what you learned from those who have every desire to disparage Christ at every opportunity.

Wrong--I'm implying nothing; I'm saying explicitly that he's mixing up semantic-phonetic compound elements and compound-indicative elements in an attempt to misrepresent the origins of the ideograms in question. (Do you even know what the word "imply" means???) Here are my sources, one from an English-speaking author, and one from a Chinese-speaking author:

Chinese Characters: Their origin, etymology, history, classification and signification, by Dr. L. Wieger, S.J.

Chinese Writing, by Qiu Xigui (Early China Special Monograph Series No. 4, translated into English by Gilbert L. Mattos and Jerry Norman)

And no, Nipper, I'm not disparaging Christ. I'm disparaging your misrepresentations.

And you don't want to see, that coincidence after coincidence (regarding not just a few ancient Chinese characters) doesn't amount to the likely conclusion that there is much more going on than you care to accept.

Do you even know what the difference is between a "coincidence" and a blatant misrepresentation?

Yet, you will accept evolution based on far less circumstantial evidence.....

Oh, I see; instead of asking me what I will and will not accept you're going to tell me what I will and will not accept.

And how did we get from Chinese ideograms to Evolution? Are you attempting to beat a hasty retreat from a losing battle?

[_Ceeboo]

Hey TEA!

And how did we get from Chinese ideograms to Evolution?

Punctuated equilibrium?


(To see this thread go as long as it has - and to see the amount of views that it has - is completely mind-bending to me!)

Peace,
Ceeboo