Creedal Trinity misunderstood by LDS

[_Albion]

Well, it seems clear to me that despite this lengthy thread those who disagree with the Christian concept of the Trinity still do not understand it. Again, simply put it teaches that within the unity of ONE DIETY (one God) there are three separate Persons who are coequal in power, nature, and eternity.

Now given that, the parody statement could read: "Hear, O Israel! The (me and two other Gods) is the the one and only God who is One...er, three, er... or more than three if you count the ones who went before and those who will come later who are still working on it...."

Now its okay to have your little chuckle but somewhere in the process honesty requires that you understand exactly what it is that you are laughing at and apparently you don't.

Now, since no one has answered my earlier questions I'll repeat them. How could Jesus be a God (the God of the Old Testament to Mormons) before he came to earth to get a body when a body is so important in the plan of eternal progression to godhood? How, too, can the HS be a God, when he does not have a body at all and is Spirit?

[_subgenius]

Well, it seems clear to me that despite this lengthy thread those who disagree with the Christian concept of the Trinity still do not understand it. Again, simply put it teaches that within the unity of ONE DIETY (one God) there are three separate Persons who are coequal in power, nature, and eternity.

i said before, the Christian algebra of one is actually three and three is actually one is something that i understand, and i understand that "trinity" is obviously a term of convenience.
but what do you mean by "Persons"? because that seems to be less than divine in nature.
The trinity has been misconstrued as a oneness of being when the scriptures support that it is just a oneness in purpose....interestingly enough the concept of oneness in essence is not a Hebrew concept but a Greek one....hmmm

When Jesus speaks of oneness with the Father He also invites us into that same oneness (see John 17:20-23) a clear indication of purpose not "being".
I do appreciate that we can share a common idea as is best illustrated here on page 21
http://web001.rbc.org/pdf/discovery-ser ... e-gods.pdf

"Each lives with the other two in an I-You relationship. Each Person is self-conscious and self-directing. Yet one Person never acts independently of the others or in opposition to them. The mind, will, and emotions of each Person is in perfect unity with the mind, will, and emotions of the other two"

that whole page is an interesting read....and i agree that they are not 3 separate persons....

Now given that, the parody statement could read: "Hear, O Israel! The (me and two other Gods) is the the one and only God who is One...er, three, er... or more than three if you count the ones who went before and those who will come later who are still working on it...."

Now its okay to have your little chuckle but somewhere in the process honesty requires that you understand exactly what it is that you are laughing at and apparently you don't.

not a parody, a logical application of the posters claims whereas they insist that the Lord is not schizophrenic but insists on having Him behave that way.
what i am laughing at is how the Creed has succeeded in confounding so many with its elaborate workings to disembody an embodied God, and by that disembodiment has left so many unable to grab onto little more than a resolution that three must be one and one must be three.

Now, since no one has answered my earlier questions I'll repeat them. How could Jesus be a God (the God of the Old Testament to Mormons) before he came to earth to get a body when a body is so important in the plan of eternal progression to godhood? How, too, can the HS be a God, when he does not have a body at all and is Spirit?

i believe your application of progression is misaligned.

Jesus has always existed - John 8:58 "58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am."
Consider that as the only "Begotten" Jesus has a relationship with Heavenly Father that is unknown to us.
The Lord reveals and commands for His purpose and not our own.

There is no reason that the deification of man is the means by which The Father, the Son, or the HG came into being, especially if it is understood that all have always existed.
perhaps you should research imago dei and rephrase your question?

[_Albion]

Persons only in the sense of not having a better descriptive word.

[_Mittens]

the Trinitarian platform contains three planks: (1) there is but one God; (2) the Father is God, the Son is God, and the Holy Spirit is God; (3) Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are eternally distinct.

The first plank underscores that there is only one God. Christianity is not polytheistic but fiercely monotheistic. “You are my witnesses, declares the Lord, and my servant whom I have chosen, so that you may know and believe me and understand that I am he. Before me no god was formed, nor will there be one after me” (Isaiah 43:10, The second plank emphasizes that in hundreds of Scripture passages the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are declared to be fully and completely God. As a case in point, the apostle Paul says that, “there is but one God the Father” (1 Corinthians 8:6). The Father, speaking of the Son, says, “Your throne, O God, will last forever and forever” (Hebrews 1:8). And when Ananias “lied to the Holy Spirit,” Peter points out that he had “not lied to men but to God” (Acts 5:3–4).

The third plank of the Trinitarian platform asserts that the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are eternally distinct. Scripture clearly portrays subject/object relationships between Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. For example, the Father and Son love one another, speak to each other (John 17:1–26), and together send the Holy Spirit (John 15:26). Additionally, Jesus proclaims that he and the Father are two distinct witnesses and two distinct judges (John 8:14–18). If Jesus were himself the Father, his argument would have been not only irrelevant but also fatally flawed; and if such were the case, he could not have been fully God.

[_gdemetz]

Absolutely stupid! If I told you that I and two of my friends were really one being, what would you think? You would probably think that I was ready for the funny farm! The simple fact is that they are THREE SEPARATE BEINGS (AND NOT ONE BEING AS THE DOCTRINE OF THE TRINITY TEACHES) WHO ARE WORSHIPED AS ONE GODHEAD, OR ONE GOD!!! That make sense! The false doctrine of the trinity does not and is absurd!!! Christ stated that He would pray for His apostles that they may all be one JUST AS HE AND HIS FATHER WERE ONE! Do you believe that the apostles were all one being of the same substance?!? Dumb!

[_Mittens]

Absolutely stupid! If I told you that I and two of my friends were really one being, what would you think? You would probably think that I was ready for the funny farm! The simple fact is that they are THREE SEPARATE BEINGS (AND NOT ONE BEING AS THE DOCTRINE OF THE TRINITY TEACHES) WHO ARE WORSHIPED AS ONE GODHEAD, OR ONE GOD!!! That make sense! The false doctrine of the trinity does not and is absurd!!! Christ stated that He would pray for His apostles that they may all be one JUST AS HE AND HIS FATHER WERE ONE! Do you believe that the apostles were all one being of the same substance?!? Dumb!

gdemetz lacks reading comprehension since the Trinity says three separate and distinct persons represent the One God


God in Three Persons E Calvin Beisner

The doctrine of the Trinity----that in the nature of the One True God, there are three distinct persons, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit, each fully God, Coequal and Coeternal


When we have said these three things, then—that there is but one God, that the Father and the Son and the Spirit is each a distinct person—we have enunciated the doctrine of the Trinity in its completeness.

We may condense this into a somewhat shorter statement, one which is more precise: In the nature of the God, there are three distinct persons, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit ( or substance ) of the one true God, there are three distinct persons, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit p 24

“The Nicene Creed, then, with centuries of theological discussion and controversy behind it, still teaches of the Trinity as the New Testament does: that the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit, while distinct from each other personally, are the same God” p 153

The concept of Trinity in unity, three distinct persons who are the one God, is then firmly entrenched in Christian thought by the middle to second century
Page 54

Thus the connection of the Father in the Son, and of the Son in the Paraclete, produces three Co-herent Persons, who are yet distinct One from Another. These Three are one essence, not one Person, as it is said, “ I and my Father are One “ in respect of unity of substance, not singularity of number. Roberts and Donaldson, anti-Nicene Fathers Vol. 3, p. 621, against Praxeas, xxv

Conclusion
The New Testament teaches us that there is one God and that this God is three distinct persons, the Father the Son, and the Holy Spirit, and that these persons are co-equal and co-eternal. This is also the only possible interpretation of the Nicene Creed as it was intended by its authors. Therefore, the doctrine of the Trinity as taught in the Nicene Creed is an accurate representation of the teachings of the New Testament” pp 155-156
E. Calvin Beisner

[_gdemetz]

Aren't you forgetting something Mittens?!? According to the false doctrine of the trinity, those three persons are ONE BEING!!! If they weren't one being, then it would be Mormon doctrine!!! Note this following quote from Wikipedia:

" The {so-called} Christian doctrine of the Trinity defines God as three divine persons: the Father, the Son (Jesus Christ), and the Holy Spirit. The three persons are distinct yet coexist in unity, and are coequal, co-eternal, and CONSUBSTIANTIAL. Put another way, the three persons of the Trinity ARE OF ONE BEING. The Trinity is considered to be a mystery {no $#!&&, MYSTERY BABYLON!} OF {FALSE} Christian faith."

[_Mittens]

Being is a word that means Godhead not person

Substance God Godhead Essence and being are the same, always singular, persons is always plural

please provide evidence chapter and verse I'm wrong . Rather than your fales assumptions

[_subgenius]

Being is a word that means Godhead not person

Substance God Godhead Essence and being are the same, always singular, persons is always plural

please provide evidence chapter and verse I'm wrong . Rather than your fales assumptions

the burden of proof is on you, for you have made the claim. LINK
we can wait...

[_Albion]

Rephrased question. Given that Mormonism teaches an "eternal progression" and under that principle God was once a man who live on an earth like ours, gained a body and exaltation, and became the God of this world...how is it possible that his son was able to skip the process and jump to godhood before he gained a body. How, too, can the Holy Spirit be a god when he, even now, does not have a body. I think those are simple questions which point up flaws in the scenario but since I don't accept any of it, I am just curious as to how it is explained.