richardMdBorn wrote:GIMR wrote:moksha wrote:Roger Morrison wrote:GIMR, thank You for what you put into the Universe. It is said, "no thought, word or deed is ever lost." That they go to make up the Universal "Grit Ball" that will either polish-up or wear-down humanity as it evolves/devolves...
Thank God for all our sakes, that when all is said and done, Grace will triumph over our Karma.
LOL, Roger! Grit ball is a fun game. You should ask Gaz about it, I told him how it's played.
I think I'm so harsh on issues like this because I want the people who judge the "sinners" to feel the weight and the heat they throw out. You wanna dish it on gay people? Fine, I'll dish it right back on you. You wanna talk about how superior you are, because you "know the Bible", fine. I'll ask you plenty of questions, and you'd better not slip once.
If the milk and the meat are sitting side by side on your table as you sit around and quote Deuteronomy to your kids, telling them how sinful gays are, then you are a hypocrite. Plain and simple.
I just finished my theism in postmodern society paper. I learned a lot, and I think the subject of postmodernism is really relevant here. We had weeks of debate about this in class. I plan to delve deeper. But for now, I'm gonna go eat.
Please explain your comment about Deuteronomy in light of Acts 15:19-21 and Acts 10-11:18.
Richard,
This is about a fight for you, and a need to be right. I will address this one question, and then your judgement of gays is your salvation. I'm not going to hurt myself trying to get you to see that you need to step back from this. Because hurt myself I will. I will start remembering all the run-ins I've had with people who SWEAR they're more knowledgable about God or in tune with God than others. And I'll remember how they disgusted and disturbed me, and how I once told a terrible lie due to tangling with them "God is not my refuge". How I regret that day, and all because I let someone's need to be holier than someone else get to me.
Forgive me for using a concordance. Unlike you, my liege, I'm a student.
I am unworthy. But I know enough to search until I'm satisfied with what I find.
On Acts 15:19-21:
You know the New Testament, right? You know that most of the early Christians were Jews? Of course! YOU know the New Testament better than anyone else here. I haven't even taken that class in school yet, I'll do that in the fall. I'd prefer my summer to be as thoughtless as possible, so the blood vessels in my brain stay in tact. Tangent. Anyways...
The very first chapter of a book I happened to pick up from B&N, a overview of the history of Christianity talks about this. It also speaks about the cultural clashes between Jew and Christian, because Christianity had in many ways adopted Jewish customs and gained a new meaning in them through Christ. There were many arguments over doctrine, and whether or not Jewish Christians were even responsible for obeying Jewish law still.
The first scriptures you quoted, I'm surprised you didn't look at the historical undertones of what Paul was saying. He was saying for the Gentiles not to offend the Jews, as there were many Jews who didn't understand that
their law was made obsolete in Christ. But of course what you see is this:
Instead we should write to them, telling them to abstain from food polluted by idols, from sexual immorality, from the meat of strangled animals and from blood.
And that's all.
Acts 10-11:18 tells a story....I don't see anything against gay people. But perhaps the crusade has changed for a moment! Let's keep reading...[pause]
Some things stand out to me though"
Hmmmm...."what God has cleansed, you must not call common". (Acts 10:15) You say faith is all that is needed. So a gay person who professes faith in Christ, what is he or she in your eyes? A child of God? Or just a gay person?
Cornelius falls down to worship Peter in this passage, and Peter says, "Stand up, I myself am also a man" (v. 26). If Peter, one of the church fathers could be so humble, who some ordinary man whom he does not know how to live life? Does God no longer have the power to convict individual hearts that we have to SHOUT for him?
Verses 34-35 I'm sure will be a favorite of yours. Whoever fears him and works righteousness is accepted by Him. So you get to choose what that is based on your interpretation, correct?
When in Old Testament survey for school, I began to think on why homosexuality was seen as such a grievance at that time. Your wealth was seen by how many children you had, among other things. You were seen as favored by God if your children were allowed to live in such perilous times. You could only do that by a heterosexual union. So in a way I can understand why THEY, given the mindset that they had, could have such animosity against gay people. But not today.
The remainder of this chapter is a sermon by Peter on the wonders of God. No anti-homosexuality there. What were you getting at, Richard? A plea for me to have mercy on you? I haven't said you cannot live your life, or that you don't have the right to the American Dream. You get to go home safe and sound, no one is persecuting you. But in the life of those who feel that their religion is the be all and end all, ANY questions or observations other than praise are persecution.
Chapter 11 up until verse 18 is Peter explaining to the disciples why he ate with uncircumscised men. Why? Because God said so.
What does this have to do with your feelings against gay people?