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Re: “King Pharaoh, whose name is given in the characters above his head”

Posted: Tue Aug 16, 2022 1:21 pm
by Shulem
Moksha wrote:
Tue Aug 16, 2022 7:30 am
Reformed Egyptian Trivia - Neithhotep is the earliest named woman in history. A queen consort of Pharoah Narmer in Ancient Egypt, Neithhotep had her name recorded between circa 3150 and 3125 BCE.

The dynastic beginning of a unified Egyptian state long predates the biblical times of Noah and Abraham. Predynastic Egypt was an ancient civilization before Noah was ever conceived! Furthermore, Neithhotep and her contemporaries were ruling Egypt a thousand years before Joseph Smith’s so-called queen Egyptus (bogus name) discovered the Delta under water and the preposterous idea of Egypt’s founding by a Hamite king named Pharaoh. The whole story is outrageous! It’s absolute fiction.

There is universal consensus that the story of how Egypt came to be as recorded in the Book of Abraham chapter one is absolute fiction as is the assertion that a king’s name is in the label of Facsimile No. 3. The Book of Abraham is a lie told by Joseph Smith. It may safely be discarded as nonhistorical nonsense or more politely termed as modern pseudepigrapha.

There is nothing apologists or Mormon Egyptologists can do to save the Book of Abraham.

The First Vision

Posted: Sun Aug 28, 2022 1:17 pm
by Shulem
Here in the Celestial forum, I have another thread entitled The First Vision where I demonstrate when Smith bragged about his ability to translate Egyptian, he inadvertently confessed that this was the time in which he changed his story about who appeared to him in the First Vision and developed his doctrine of the plurality of gods. I highly suggest that readers take a look at this thread and reason it out for themselves. It wasn’t until 1835 that Smith began to shift from the traditional Trinitarian view of God (One Person expressed in Three ways) to the plurality of God being separate Persons and that the Father and Son have individual bodies of flesh and bone. Thus, Smith was heavily influenced by the vignettes that were illustrated on the Egyptian scrolls in which he purchased -- the very scrolls he claimed were drawn by the hands of Abraham and Joseph of Egypt.

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The early First Vision accounting of glorified Jesus appearing to Joseph Smith in the grove in New York was later changed to reflect the idea that BOTH Jesus and the Father appeared and the doctrine of One God as taught in the Book of Mormon gave way to Three Gods. I find a stunning comparison in Smith’s imagination between the doctrine of plurality of the gods and a King’s name in the writing of the Facsimile. Smith’s imaginary views of the papyrus associated the imagery therein to represent the God of the Bible just as he did the writing to represent an Egyptian King’s name. These two points work hand in hand to prove Smith was making it all up. Both accounts are a lie!
  • “King Pharaoh, whose name is given in the characters above his head.”
  • “I saw two Personages, whose brightness and glory defy all description, standing above me in the air. One of them spake unto me, calling me by name and said, pointing to the other—This is My Beloved Son. Hear Him!”

I bear my testimony that I know both accounts are false. Joseph Smith was lying about the papyrus and his visionary experiences with God in the New York grove. I’ve never in all my life known someone to lie so much other than former President Donald J. Trump who is a terrible stain on American history.

Re: “King Pharaoh, whose name is given in the characters above his head”

Posted: Sun Aug 28, 2022 11:16 pm
by Shulem
Sooner or later, eventually, it’s inevitable that a leading General Authority will publicly say something about the Facsimile in which the topic of the “King’s name” will spill out. It’s only a matter of time and some poor General Authority is going to slip up. When he does it will generate and incite more questions from the faithful who are looking for answers from their leaders rather than from scholars and apologists who don’t answer for the Lord. The critics will be on hand to analyze exactly what is said and refuse to accept it as authoritative and instantly appeal to the Church President for a definitive response. Then, the President of the Church will be in the hot seat as fingers point at him as one who has no special powers to divine, no ability to translate, and is completely unable to interpret Smith’s explanations of the hieroglyphic writing on the papyrus.

Re: The First Vision

Posted: Tue Aug 30, 2022 4:44 am
by bill4long
..

Re: The First Vision

Posted: Tue Aug 30, 2022 4:45 am
by bill4long
Shulem wrote:
Sun Aug 28, 2022 1:17 pm
...other than former President Donald J. Trump who is a terrible stain on American history.
I don't like Trump either. But let's not pretend our current idiot-in-chief is clean. Decades of dirty politics. Burisma. Council on Foreign Relations. 10% for the Big Guy. LIttle kid Hair sniffer. Come on, the guy is a revolting demented weirdo grifter. America can do better than all of this.

False prophets offer nothing

Posted: Tue Aug 30, 2022 1:30 pm
by Shulem
bill4long wrote:
Tue Aug 30, 2022 4:44 am
..

That’s an accurate summation of what the prophets have said about the problems with the Book of Abraham translations and the phony-baloney text in chapter one that attempts to tell the world how and when Egypt first became a nation. The so-called prophets today claim to be seers and revelators but they see nothing and reveal nothing. They even claim to possess the same gifts possessed by Joseph Smith and yet these men translate nothing. All they do is provide regurgitated talks with the same old tired song and dance and maintain a multibillion dollar business overseen by lawyers. They avoid the difficult questions because they have no answers that will suffice. It must be frustrating for them as they continue the charade and pretend to be what they are not. Therefore, it’s incumbent upon the critics to keep up the pressure and sound the alarm long and loud -- nonstop.

What is that alarm?

The Book of Abraham is a fraudulent story of Egyptian history. It’s not true.


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Re: “King Pharaoh, whose name is given in the characters above his head”

Posted: Sat Nov 19, 2022 12:01 am
by Everybody Wang Chung
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Re: “King Pharaoh, whose name is given in the characters above his head”

Posted: Sat Nov 19, 2022 1:49 pm
by Shulem
If I was standing in the presence of Joseph Smith either in Kirtland or Nauvoo in the midst of his family and friends, I would confront and challenge the prophet before him and the entire Church. I would tell the prophet to his face that the papyri in his possession are not records of Abraham and Joseph but are funerary rites and spells of the Egyptian religion and are a means to connect the Egyptian dead with their gods.

I would tell Joseph there is no king’s name in Facsimile No. 3 and that all of his interpretations and explanations of the Facsimiles are absolutely and totally wrong. I would testify that I know his translations are bogus.

What would Joseph say? How would he react?

The Top Ten Happenings in Mopologetics, 2022

Posted: Sun Dec 11, 2022 5:07 pm
by Shulem
Doctor Scratch wrote:
Thu Dec 08, 2022 1:14 am
You are a true legend, Shulem. If the stars were somehow to align so that you could debate Gee head-to-head, it would be epic. It will never happen, but in a just world, someone would find a way to get it done.

Well, suppose that Dr. Gee and myself stepped into a time machine together and went back to the year 1842 to meet up with Joseph Smith in Nauvoo to confront him and discuss his new publication of the Book of Abraham. Obviously, Gee and I have inside information of how the Book of Abraham came into existence and are aware of the content of his private manuscripts (GAEL) locked up in the President’s office.

Do you suppose that professor Gee would have some questions for Joseph Smith? I can only imagine what he might ask the prophet. Perhaps Gee would like to pop into this thread, here in this forum, and list a few of those question that he would politely ask Joseph Smith prior to me saying anything and confronting the prophet to contradict his Egyptian translations. What might Gee ask the prophet?

John Gee wrote: Q 1.
Q 2.
Q 3.

Then, after the prophet answers the questions, I will cut right in and take the prophet head on and twist the arms of John Gee until he cries, “I’ve had enough, Smith is lying, let’s go home now.”

:mrgreen:

Merry Christmas, professor Gee! We know there is no King’s name given under heaven or written in the label whereby Joseph Smith can be saved!

White head drawn upon a black man

Posted: Tue Dec 27, 2022 11:09 pm
by Shulem
Dummy wrote: Smith published a Caucasian-like head atop the body of a Negroid. That’s a bullseye for the Book of Abraham!

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A white man’s head upon the body of a black man is absolutely uninspiring. It shows the utter stupidity of Smith’s ability to correctly interpret anything Egyptian. And, we see the stupidity of LDS Egyptologists who are unable or unwilling to properly critique Smith’s blunders. Bad scholarship and dishonesty is what BYU produces when it comes to explaining the Book of Abraham and the silly Explanations of the Facsimiles. Shame on the Church!

Happy holidays, everyone!