The First Vision

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Shulem
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Re: The First Vision

Post by Shulem »

Here’s the deal:

Imagine 14-year-old Joseph actually seeing TWO persons in an 1820 vision in which one of them introduced the other by pointing the finger. Any information or testimonial Joseph may have shared with anyone between 1820-1835 would have been leaked and the public would have been apprised of a Christian heresy originating from the Smith family farm.

Joseph Smith never, ever, claimed to see two persons in a vision prior to changing his beliefs of the Godhead from Trinitarian to a plurality of the gods.

Cased closed.

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I bear my testimony that I know with every part of my mind and heart that Joseph Smith’s 1838 testimonial of seeing two persons in vision is a lie. Smith elected to continue a ministry which was founded upon lies.

The Church is NOT true. Even so,

Amen.
Brack
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Re: The First Vision

Post by Brack »

Some LDS Apologists have claimed that the phrase "from on high" within the introductory paragraph from the 1832 account of the first vision is a reference to God the Father.

"...an account of the rise of the church of Christ in the eve of time according as the Lord brought forth and established by his hand firstly he receiving the testamony from on high..."

The phrase "from on high" is found only one time within the Book of Mormon. It is in Ether chapter six verse 17.

Ether 6:17 - And they were taught to walk humbly before the Lord; and they were also taught from on high.

Here is a commentary on this Book of Mormon passage, which doesn't seem to equate the phrase "from on high" to God the Father.
verse 17 "they were also taught from on high" It would seem that the ideal formula for acquiring spiritual intelligence or light and truth is the combination of mental exertion and prayerful pleading and pondering. In this way we qualify for the Spirit's endowments.

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Shulem
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Re: The First Vision

Post by Shulem »

Brack wrote:
Mon Sep 04, 2023 9:39 pm
Some LDS Apologists have claimed that the phrase "from on high" within the introductory paragraph from the 1832 account of the first vision is a reference to God the Father.

The Teacher from on high *is* none other than the Holy Spirit (Isaiah 32:15), “Until the spirit be poured upon us from on high.” Jesus reconfirmed this doctrine in John saying, “But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.”

1. The Father teaches nobody because all teachings come through the Spirit (John 14:26)
2. The Father judges nobody because all judgment is given to the Son (John 5:22)

In a revelation given to Joseph Smith in 1831, Jesus announced he is the Savior of the world and that men are taught of the things of God through the Spirit from on high.

D&C 43:15,16 wrote:Again I say, hearken ye elders of my church, whom I have appointed: Ye are not sent forth to be taught, but to teach the children of men the things which I have put into your hands by the power of my Spirit;

And ye are to be taught from on high. Sanctify yourselves and ye shall be endowed with power, that ye may give even as I have spoken.
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