The CES Letter

[huckelberry]

Pyreaux, you started me thinking about hidden or deeper teachings
John15;5 I am the vine you are the branches. He who abides in me and I in him he it is that bears much fruit. If a man abides not in me he is cast forth as a branch and withers........
As the Father has loved me so have loved you, abide in my love. If you keep my commandments you will abide in my love just as I have kept my Fathers commandments and abide in his love. ...This is my commandment that you love one another as I have loved you.

There is 1 Corintheans Paul is addressing people dividing the congregation into political factions. He speaks of a spiritual knowledge beyond the basic doctrines. That knowledge is living in the New spirit of a new birth in Jesus , shared with Jesus.

This is discussed in the New Testament in a variety of ways and places. I like Romans 8;18 I consider that the sufferings of the present time are not worth comparing with the glory that is to be revealed to us. For the creation waits with eager longing for the revealing of the sons of God. For the creation was subjected to futility, not of its own will but by the will of him who subjected it in hope. because the creation will be set free from its bondage to decay and obtain the glorious liberty of the children of God.

I have at times puzzled over that passage in Mark about parables. It seems a puzzle because the parables are not difficult or hidden. clearly the parables are an outer message and another inner message is being shared selectively. In Mark who Jesus is and what he is doing is a secret but one Mark is careful to give clues and pointer about. He is leading his readers on to look for the inner message.

I found myself thinking of a youtube snippet from Bart Ehrman debating Jesus claims. It is commonplace observation that in Mark and the other synoptic gospels Jesus speaks as a prophet not divine yet in John Jesus speaks differently. One can understand that as in John we hear the inner message while Mark focuses on that outer message. Bart Ehrman would think that inner message a creation of followers after Jesus death. I am enough of a traditional believer that I can see that inner hidden message as coming from Jesus.

Parables were teachings for initiates, not common people, so "without a parable he spake not unto them" (Mk 4:34). It appeared to be just a story to hide its true meaning, so "by seeing they see not" (Mt 13.13-15; Mk 4:12; Lk 8:10). As a Melchizedek High Priest, Christ was charged with keeping temple secrets, and could only divulge them to those similarly initiated into the priesthood themselves. They should understand parable themes like death, death is a theme in the initiations (initiation is from the Latin for: the deaths). The parables have certain themes about the hereafter, or as well as information of the near future or past.

Sometimes a parable is an exposition about the temple initiation rites themselves, such as the parable of the Prodigal Son. All Christians, whether they know it or not, are aspiring to be initiated royal Melchizedek priests, and the royal road is like the Prodigal Son. The priesthood was the method in which mortals prepared themselves to enter the temple and meet God and survive in their priestly duties in the Temple. Likewise, the Christians wish be initiated in rebirth rituals in order to enter the kingdom of God.

Pyreaux, you present some interesting questions for me at least. I find I have not given a lot of thought to that matter of people not understanding the parables. They seem fairly simple and the gospels supply interpretation. Mark4;21 Is a lamp brought in to be put under a bushel, or under a bed, and not on a stand? For there is nothing hid except to be made manifest, nor is anything secret except to come to light. If any man has ears to hear let him hear.

All three gospels have this exchange with the parables and the only way I read it is that parables were for everybody but further deeper understanding for the apostles. Perhaps as you suggest the parables have occult meaning which the simplicity of their apparent story hides. After all who does not understand the prodigal son about people meeting Gods grace. I ask myself what would there be in Jesus's sharp little parables that people are missing? What I find myself considering is that they all have with their message of hope a sharp edged undercurrent of criticism. The prodigal son has a sibling who is not happy with the fathers excitement and prodigal forgiveness. Seeds on rocky ground, what has that to do with me? Maybe more than one wants to see.

[Moksha]

Atheists pretending to have Godly-moral outrage over what Joseph Smith does. Really? Do they know what God would do to, or tolerate from, a prophet, as atheists? A bit disingenuous.

If God had not wanted Joseph to get laid, he would not have sent an Angel with a Drawn Sword to drive home this point.

[Pyreaux]

Atheists pretending to have Godly-moral outrage over what Joseph Smith does. Really? Do they know what God would do to, or tolerate from, a prophet, as atheists? A bit disingenuous.

If God had not wanted Joseph to get laid, he would not have sent an Angel with a Drawn Sword to drive home this point.

Crude, but aye, or just the plural sealings themselves at the very least, from my view. It's not about sex from what I see, he's just marrying/sealing anyone willing regardless; very pregnant women, married women, very old women, very young women. As though getting a high number was the most important part rather than matters like attraction.