God and a fraud?

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_guy sajer
_Emeritus
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Joined: Tue Jan 16, 2007 2:16 am

Post by _guy sajer »

beastie wrote:
hat a God would allow a fraud of this proportion to thrive or even exist IN THE NAME OF HIS SON AND AS A WITNESS OF HIS SON is preposterous.


I think it's pretty preposterous that God allows millions of children to die neglected and abused, too. And how about all the genocide that's taken place on this earth? And horrible natural effects that slaughter millions.

And you think it's preposterous God would allow a fraud to stand in the name of his son?


God has allowed millions upon millions of his children to be murdered, tortured, abused, defrauded and oppressed in his name over the millennia.

And you think he gives a rat's ass about some piece of 19th century drivel produced by a totally irrelevant relgious sect?

The egocentrism of the true believer never ceases to amaze me.
God . . . "who mouths morals to other people and has none himself; who frowns upon crimes, yet commits them all; who created man without invitation, . . . and finally, with altogether divine obtuseness, invites this poor, abused slave to worship him ..."
_beastie
_Emeritus
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Post by _beastie »

I concur with what others have already said. There are far more than the two options you outlined.

In fact, in the spirit of your Pascal's wager, there's also an option that the LDS church is Satanic, and you will burn in hell for believing it.
We hate to seem like we don’t trust every nut with a story, but there’s evidence we can point to, and dance while shouting taunting phrases.

Penn & Teller

http://www.mormonmesoamerica.com
_truth dancer
_Emeritus
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Joined: Tue Oct 24, 2006 12:40 pm

Post by _truth dancer »

Hi MG...

AHHHHHHHHHHHh I finally figured out how you put things together! It took me a while but I think I get it now!

If it isn't what it claims to be then:

-Choose whatever lifestyle or belief system you desire, it doesn't matter. Whatever fits your needs and floats your boat...or make it up as you go along, if you want.

If these are the two choices and there is a plausibility that one of them will:

1. Bring my family and I more opportunities for blessings within Christ's church.
2. Give a greater understanding of God and his attributes.
3. Help me understand what eternal life and progress entails and what I need to do to obtain it.
4. Increase understanding of the purpose of life and how Jesus Christ fits into the whole scheme of things.
5. Bring a greater degree of happiness in the here and now through obedience to God's commandments.
6. Provide correct teachings/principles without being blown around by every wind of doctrine.

...then I'll take that one.


You think there are two options in life. The LDS church as the one and only, or choose whatever you want because nothing matters which leads to a horrible life.

If these are the two choices and there is a plausibility that one of them will:


You only see ONLY these two options which is why you think the LDS church is the better option.

I GET IT!

I think the reason we all can't go with you is because we don't see these two options as the only options.

Knowing that the world is filled with religions and belief systems, that also claim they are the one and only way to God, and knowing there are all sorts of ways to live a good, decent, honorable, loving life, most of us see thousands of options in terms of how to live a good life.

IN other words... for us, (I think I am speaking for most of us here), it is not the LDS church or nothing/horrible life.

Just as it is not Scientology or nothing/horrible life, FLDS or nothing/horrible life, Islam or nothing/horrible life, Catholicism or nothing/horrible life, Hinduism or nothing/horrible life, Buddhism or nothing/horrible life, etc. etc. etc.

For most of us it is more like... "which of the thousands of options available is most likely to be true, feels the most holy, seems to be most correct, appears most reasonable, provides one's life with a sense of peace, makes the most sense etc. etc. etc."

Does that make sense? Do you see why we can't seem to follow some of your ideas? (smile)

I have stated before, if one thinks that if they leave the LDS church or stop believing in Joseph Smith, they will become a horrible, sinful, cruel, disgusting human being, by all means they should stay a believer. :-)

My personal observation is that there are great, wonderful, fabulous, honorable, loving people in all sorts of religions and without any religion or belief in God.

I truly do not see the LDS folks or any other religious group, (with the possible exception of Buddhism which is not a religion but a philosophy), as more holy, more kind, more loving, more "righteous" than any other group.

Anyway... I understand you are done with this thread but I am glad I finally figured out how you experience life and why you believe as you do! :-)

Warmest wishes my friend and good luck on your projects!

~dancer~
"The search for reality is the most dangerous of all undertakings for it destroys the world in which you live." Nisargadatta Maharaj
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