Where was the LDS Church actually organized? Was it where they teach it was or was it in Manchester, NY?
How many different names was the Church known by? I would think God would have given them the name right away if it was actually of any importance.
A few questions on organization
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_JoetheClerk
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_cinepro
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Re: A few questions on organization
JoetheClerk wrote:Where was the LDS Church actually organized? Was it where they teach it was or was it in Manchester, NY?
The whole story is in lesson #6 in this manual.
How many different names was the Church known by? I would think God would have given them the name right away if it was actually of any importance.
I agree that it probably isn't very important. If the Church is true, then it would still be true even if it had a different name.
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_Dr. Shades
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Re: A few questions on organization
JoetheClerk wrote:Where was the LDS Church actually organized? Was it where they teach it was or was it in Manchester, NY?
D. Michael Quinn was able to piece together that it was both. Joseph and company put on the same show two times for the benefit of his followers in two different areas.
How many different names was the Church known by? I would think God would have given them the name right away if it was actually of any importance.
It has been known by three names:
- The Church of Jesus Christ.
- The Church of the Latter-day Saints.
- The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
"Finally, for your rather strange idea that miracles are somehow linked to the amount of gay sexual gratification that is taking place would require that primitive Christianity was launched by gay sex, would it not?"
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_Nevo
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Re: A few questions on organization
The Manchester location has considerable support: the 1833 Book of Commandments, the March and April 1833 issues of The Evening and the Morning Star, Joseph Smith's 1842 Wentworth Letter, and William Smith all list Manchester as the location of the 6 April 1830 organizational meeting. Manchester is also implied in Joseph Knight Sr.'s recollection. Also, two neighbors of the Smiths said they were present at the baptisms of Joseph Smith Sr. and Martin Harris--which, according to Lucy Smith, Joseph Knight, and others, took place the same day the Church was organized.
David Whitmer, on the other hand, consistently claimed that the Church was organized at his father's log cabin in Fayette, and Joseph Smith's 1838 history (now JS-History) also has Fayette. So it's a bit of a mystery.
As Shades suggested, I think there were organizational meetings at both Manchester and Fayette--Manchester on Tuesday, April 6th, and Fayette the following Sunday, April 11th. The first conference of the Church (consisting of the Colesville, Manchester, and Fayette branches) took place in Fayette on 6 June 1830, and it may be that some of the details of this meeting were conflated with the April 6th meeting (this appears to be the case with JS-H at least).
David Whitmer, on the other hand, consistently claimed that the Church was organized at his father's log cabin in Fayette, and Joseph Smith's 1838 history (now JS-History) also has Fayette. So it's a bit of a mystery.
As Shades suggested, I think there were organizational meetings at both Manchester and Fayette--Manchester on Tuesday, April 6th, and Fayette the following Sunday, April 11th. The first conference of the Church (consisting of the Colesville, Manchester, and Fayette branches) took place in Fayette on 6 June 1830, and it may be that some of the details of this meeting were conflated with the April 6th meeting (this appears to be the case with JS-H at least).
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_JoetheClerk
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Re: A few questions on organization
I went to the site mentioned and looked at the manual. It has the wrong town for Church Organization.
If they are lying about the beginnings, how much else is a lie?
If God gave the specific date of organization I would think he would know the name they chose would not hold up because it was already taken. I would think God would know what the name should be from the start.
Too much does not add up and a 'manual' that has incorrect information about the beginnings of the Church is suspect.
I do know from reading in the Joseph Smith Sunday School manual that some of what is printed is wrong. Joseph could not have baptized his father and exclaimed 'I have seen my father baptized into the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints' as that name was not in existance at that time.
Again, If you are lying about the little things why would you think I would believe the big ones?
If they are lying about the beginnings, how much else is a lie?
If God gave the specific date of organization I would think he would know the name they chose would not hold up because it was already taken. I would think God would know what the name should be from the start.
Too much does not add up and a 'manual' that has incorrect information about the beginnings of the Church is suspect.
I do know from reading in the Joseph Smith Sunday School manual that some of what is printed is wrong. Joseph could not have baptized his father and exclaimed 'I have seen my father baptized into the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints' as that name was not in existance at that time.
Again, If you are lying about the little things why would you think I would believe the big ones?
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_Nevo
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Re: A few questions on organization
Yeah, the manual might be wrong. But that doesn't mean that anyone is necessarily "lying." Joseph Smith's official history named Fayette, so I don't blame the Church for following his lead. Like I said, the evidence is inconclusive. Maybe Elder John K. Carmack is right and Fayette is the place.
What manual says this?
JoetheClerk wrote:I do know from reading in the Joseph Smith Sunday School manual that some of what is printed is wrong. Joseph could not have baptized his father and exclaimed 'I have seen my father baptized into the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints' as that name was not in existance at that time.
What manual says this?