=>Ex-Mo=>Liberal or Libertarian?

[_huckelberry]

Ranting on, The craziest political idea is that just making government smaller is a solution. Better government, better laws are more important than size adjustment. If the elected government power decreases then the power of unelected government, corporations, increases filling the space. I believe in a division of power where corporations rule in their limited sphere but to allow take over of large social areas by unelected power is the end of freedom.

Sell the public roadways to private corporations and you have sold the right of free movement in society. 1984

[_huckelberry]

Rant on, and I hope this one is false.

I wonder if Mormons are easy with the idea of shrinking government role and allowing private companies to rule because their social structure teaches them to mistrust elections and choice. They are taught that the true social authority arrives from above to be affirmed by raising your hand. You do not choose you accept and obey. You do this for your boss at work , at church, why not trade in the foolishness of voting and electing officials for corporate heads who just run things?

I wonder if Mormons are tempted to be easy with such a version of freedom because they are taught that they are special enough to be in the top portions of a feudal power arrangement?

[_son of Ishmael]

Ranting on, The craziest political idea is that just making government smaller is a solution. Better government, better laws are more important than size adjustment. If the elected government power decreases then the power of unelected government, corporations, increases filling the space. I believe in a division of power where corporations rule in their limited sphere but to allow take over of large social areas by unelected power is the end of freedom.

Sell the public roadways to private corporations and you have sold the right of free movement in society. 1984

That is a good point/question. Is the size of the government as important as it's ability to function? I also think there is an issue of what should be done at what level? for example does there need to be a department of education or should that be handled at the state and local governments?

[_sock puppet]

I think if you measure quality of life purely in materialistic terms, there is a good argument for government, even more government.

But if you find intrinsic value in individual freedom, I think you find that there are tipping points, when each is crossed by the encroaching government, something of value is lost.

[_huckelberry]

I think if you measure quality of life purely in materialistic terms, there is a good argument for government, even more government.

But if you find intrinsic value in individual freedom, I think you find that there are tipping points, when each is crossed by the encroaching government, something of value is lost.

I certainly value individual freedom enough that I can see your point. Government can throw its weight around abusing freedoms. Big government can be dumb unresponsive and inflexible due to size. There may be places big government tries to do things better done by private organizations. Bigger is hardly a guarantee of better. But government is supposed to protect our freedoms and must be big enough to do so.

Government must be big enough to stop the paper mill down the river from me from pumping sickening clouds of sulfur dioxide into the sky for me to breath. The government made them stop. I do not know anybody unhappy with those oppressive government regulations. On the other hand I am sure there are some ridiculous regulations to be junked. Something about ice cream comes to mind.
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The above words were thinking of Son of Ishmeals comment as well.

[_moksha]

No matter how much bureaucracy and unresponsiveness a government can generate, I can think of private and corporate organizations that can generate more.

Voting one's pocketbook rather than religion is not really a novel idea, but for some it comes as a newly found freedom.

[_Kishkumen]

I think if you measure quality of life purely in materialistic terms, there is a good argument for government, even more government.

But if you find intrinsic value in individual freedom, I think you find that there are tipping points, when each is crossed by the encroaching government, something of value is lost.

Yeah, I can't say that I am enthusiastic about either candidate's philosophy on the role of government.

[_MCB]

Big government can be dumb unresponsive and inflexible due to size. There may be places big government tries to do things better done by private organizations.

Or states. As in dept of education-- should only act in advisory role in helping states resolve problems. And in funding for schools in states (or districts) that do not have a good tax base.