Jesus - militant or lover of peace?

[_honorentheos]

This is from another thread in the off-topic forum:

I see your comment as a false dichotomy between peaceful acceptance and militant divisiveness.

Now you're getting it. The entire subtext of the scriptures (and therefore my subtext) is war.

If respectful disagreement is now a lost art, its not a failure of the virtue of the form. 1 John 2 my friend.

Love that chapter:

3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.
4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

6 He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked

17 And the world passeth away, and the lust thereof: but he that doeth the will of God abideth for ever.

22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.
23 Whosoever denieth the Son, the same hath not the Father: [but] he that acknowledgeth the Son hath the Father also.

No Democrat in this day and age walks with Christ. It's an intrinsic property of the situation.

29 If ye know that he is righteous, ye know that every one that doeth righteousness is born of him.

Socialism and big government tyranny, appeasement of those who oppress their people, abortion as a method of birth control, and gay marriage are not righteousness.

9 He that saith he is in the light, and hateth his brother, is in darkness even until now.
10 He that loveth his brother abideth in the light, and there is none occasion of stumbling in him.
11 But he that hateth his brother is in darkness, and walketh in darkness, and knoweth not whither he goeth, because that darkness hath blinded his eyes.

Are you ready to declare that Jesus, who initiated and pronounced quite a lot of violence on the wicked, Old Testament and New Testament, hates his brother?

[_sock puppet]

This is from another thread in the off-topic forum:

* * * Are you ready to declare that Jesus, who initiated and pronounced quite a lot of violence on the wicked, Old Testament and New Testament, hates his brother?

Onward, Christian soldiers!

[_honorentheos]

BC,

I don't follow how most of your thoughts followed from the portions of 1 John 2 you quote. For example:

3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.
4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

6 He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked

17 And the world passeth away, and the lust thereof: but he that doeth the will of God abideth for ever.

22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.
23 Whosoever denieth the Son, the same hath not the Father: [but] he that acknowledgeth the Son hath the Father also.

No Democrat in this day and age walks with Christ. It's an intrinsic property of the situation.

I feel like I could say any random thing and it would make the same amount of sense as your statement.

"While one could make a good case for the panda, it's a liar who denies koala bears are the most cuddly of bears. It's an intrinsic property of the situation."

I used a couple of words from the scripture quote so it must align somehow, is that how it works?

29 If ye know that he is righteous, ye know that every one that doeth righteousness is born of him.

Socialism and big government tyranny, appeasement of those who oppress their people, abortion as a method of birth control, and gay marriage are not righteousness.

"Oppressing workers, destroying the environment for the sake of immediate profit, prioritizing military spending over domestic needs such as education and forcing people to practise tenets of your religion because they need the job you offer them are not righteousness."

So I make a list of things I disagree with politically that someone claims are morality-based and claim I occupy the moral high ground. Got it.

9 He that saith he is in the light, and hateth his brother, is in darkness even until now.
10 He that loveth his brother abideth in the light, and there is none occasion of stumbling in him.
11 But he that hateth his brother is in darkness, and walketh in darkness, and knoweth not whither he goeth, because that darkness hath blinded his eyes.

Are you ready to declare that Jesus, who initiated and pronounced quite a lot of violence on the wicked, Old Testament and New Testament, hates his brother?

Maybe. If we include the Mormon Jehovah and look at the world around us, maybe "He hates us" is a reasonable answer to a lot of questions. Are you suggesting that everyone killed in the horrible wars and calamities of the Old Testament were wicked?

Are these the words of Jesus and exempt from 1 John's claim that to hate one's brother is to be in darkness?

Deuteronomy 21:10-14

10 When thou goest forth to war against thine enemies, and the Lord thy God hath delivered them into thine hands, and thou hast taken them captive,

11 And seest among the captives a beautiful woman, and hast a desire unto her, that thou wouldest have her to thy wife;

12 Then thou shalt bring her home to thine house, and she shall shave her head, and pare her nails;

13 And she shall put the raiment of her captivity from off her, and shall remain in thine house, and bewail her father and her mother a full month: and after that thou shalt go in unto her, and be her husband, and she shall be thy wife.

14 And it shall be, if thou have no delight in her, then thou shalt let her go whither she will; but thou shalt not sell her at all for money, thou shalt not make merchandise of her, because thou hast humbled her.

Matthew 6:22-23

22 The light of the body is the eye: if therefore thine eye be single, thy whole body shall be full of light.

23 But if thine eye be evil, thy whole body shall be full of darkness. If therefore the light that is in thee be darkness, how great is that darkness!

1 John 2:9-11

9 He that saith he is in the light, and hateth his brother, is in darkness even until now.

10 He that loveth his brother abideth in the light, and there is none occasion of stumbling in him.

11 But he that hateth his brother is in darkness, and walketh in darkness, and knoweth not whither he goeth, because that darkness hath blinded his eyes.

Seems pretty clear.

Honestly, I have a hard time seeing your version of religion as little more than a justification for bad behaviour and ill will.

Do you see your war against the world in these words from the Book of Mormon?

Mosiah 4

12 And behold, I say unto you that if ye do this ye shall always rejoice, and be filled with the love of God, and always retain a remission of your sins; and ye shall grow in the knowledge of the glory of him that created you, or in the knowledge of that which is just and true.

13 And ye will not have a mind to injure one another, but to live peaceably, and to render to every man according to that which is his due.

14 And ye will not suffer your children that they go hungry, or naked; neither will ye suffer that they transgress the laws of God, and fight and quarrel one with another, and serve the devil, who is the master of sin, or who is the devil spirit which hath been spoken of by our fathers, he being an enemy to all righteousness.

15 But ye will teach them to walk in the ways of truth and soberness; ye will teach them to love one another, and to serve one another.

16 And also, ye yourselves will succor those that stand in need of your succor; ye will administer of your substance unto him that standeth in need; and ye will not suffer that the beggar putteth up his petition to you in vain, and turn him out to perish.

17 Perhaps thou shalt asay: The man has brought upon himself his misery; therefore I will stay my hand, and will not give unto him of my food, nor impart unto him of my substance that he may not suffer, for his punishments are just—

18 But I say unto you, O man, whosoever doeth this the same hath great cause to repent; and except he repenteth of that which he hath done he perisheth forever, and hath no interest in the kingdom of God.

19 For behold, are we not all beggars? Do we not all depend upon the same Being, even God, for all the substance which we have, for both food and raiment, and for gold, and for silver, and for all the riches which we have of every kind?

What you profess, I never ever believed. If that is Mormonism, God save us from Mormonism.