92,000 BSA sex abuse claims

[Res Ipsa]

92,000 claims filed in the Boy Scouts of America bankruptcy case. Can’t help but wonder how many were in LDS sponsored troops.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/11/16/us/boy-s ... index.html

[Moksha]

https://www.courier-journal.com/story/n ... 224382002/

Scandals can have a huge scope.

[IHAQ]

I have a feeling this is more why the Church distanced itself from the BSA, rather than the letters move to inclusive and non discrimination on sexuality. Does anyone know if the Church retains liability for historical cases involving LDS troops?

[Res Ipsa]

I have a feeling this is more why the Church distanced itself from the BSA, rather than the letters move to inclusive and non discrimination on sexuality. Does anyone know if the Church retains liability for historical cases involving LDS troops?

Just guessing, but I suspect so. Every organization that sponsored a troop may have exposure.

[Lem]

I have a feeling this is more why the Church distanced itself from the BSA, rather than the letters move to inclusive and non discrimination on sexuality. Does anyone know if the Church retains liability for historical cases involving LDS troops?

I think the same. A relative in their 40s recently confided in me the sexual abuse they experienced, repeatedly, in LDS Scouting events. He also told me of the abuse his younger sibling experienced. The stories he told where he would exchange himself to protect his younger sibling are sickening. It is beyond horrific, but it is also directly attributable to the LDS church allowing abuse when they knew what was happening. The important thing to the church was to protect church reputation, and the damage they did to individuals to accomplish this is beyond disgusting. I don't know how to help this person, but I am trying.

But yes, it is absolutely clear that the separation from scouting by the LDS church is an attempt to avoid liability. The LDS church leadership has much to be accountable for, but you can be sure that massive amounts of the widows mite and tithing money from those who struggle to survive will be spent to protect the nest egg these LDS church leaders have amassed to themselves.

I am beyond ashamed of this religion in which I grew up. The damage it has done, by not only allowing the abuse but more importantly, by covering it up after the fact, only to protect the financial holdings of the LDS leaders, is despicable. It is sickening. The LDS legal council, Kirton McConkie I believe, is an immoral and perverse corporation that, contrary to the recent discussion about mercy, deserves to burn in hell forever.

[huckelberry]

I have a feeling this is more why the Church distanced itself from the BSA, rather than the letters move to inclusive and non discrimination on sexuality. Does anyone know if the Church retains liability for historical cases involving LDS troops?

I think the same. A relative in their 40s recently confided in me the sexual abuse they experienced, repeatedly, in LDS Scouting events. He also told me of the abuse his younger sibling experienced. The stories he told where he would exchange himself to protect his younger sibling are sickening. It is beyond horrific, but it is also directly attributable to the LDS church allowing abuse when they knew what was happening. The important thing to the church was to protect church reputation, and the damage they did to individuals to accomplish this is beyond disgusting. I don't know how to help this person, but I am trying.

But yes, it is absolutely clear that the separation from scouting by the LDS church is an attempt to avoid liability. The LDS church leadership has much to be accountable for, but you can be sure that massive amounts of the widows mite and tithing money from those who struggle to survive will be spent to protect the nest egg these LDS church leaders have amassed to themselves.

I am beyond ashamed of this religion in which I grew up. The damage it has done, by not only allowing the abuse but more importantly, by covering it up after the fact, only to protect the financial holdings of the LDS leaders, is despicable. It is sickening. The LDS legal council, Kirton McConkie I believe, is an immoral and perverse corporation that, contrary to the recent discussion about mercy, deserves to burn in hell forever.

I am curious about how this works. My memory of scouting was there was no occasion I can remember where we were alone and vulnerable to a predatory leader. So how did this work in those places there was a problem? I was unaware of any problem happening.In an LDS setting how did a leader bypass the lengthy teaching scouts receive in the church about making responsible decisions resisting improper sexual activity.

[Lem]

I am curious about how this works. My memory of scouting was there was no occasion I can remember where we were alone and vulnerable to a predatory leader. So how did this work in those places there was a problem? I was unaware of any problem happening.In an LDS setting how did a leader bypass the lengthy teaching scouts receive in the church about making responsible decisions resisting improper sexual activity.

I am happy to share what I can, but first, could you clarify what you mean by "the lengthy teaching scouts receive in the church about making responsible decisions resisting improper sexual activity"?

If you are referring to the 'little factory' and 'licked cupcake' lectures youth received, I don't see how that would have any impact on unsupervised and unmonitored leaders' or older youth's behavior during scout activities, overnights, camp and jamboree events. As for extensive training or background checks, it is my understanding the LDS church did not appropriately engage in protective measures. The LDS church continues to object to even the most basic of protective measures for those who volunteer with children and youth. The most significant policy involves a 'hotline' that bishops can call, that clearly is intended primarily to protect the reputation and financial position of the LDS church, not the welfare of the youth involved.

In any case, the sheer number of cases reported indicates the LDS church, a hugely significant bsa participant, had a problem:

plaintiffs’ lawyers say claims continue to pour in, predicting that tens of thousands will meet the Nov. 16 deadline. The massive response, they say, suggests a far broader abuse problem in Scouting than has been previously recognized...

Many of the lawsuits came in the wake of the Los Angeles Times’ publication in 2012 of internal Scout records involving about 5,000 men on a blacklist known as the “perversion files,” a closely guarded trove of documents that detail sexual abuse allegations against troop leaders and others dating back a century.

The Times’ yearlong examination of the files documented hundreds of cases in which the Boy Scouts failed to report accusations to authorities, concealed the allegations from parents and the public or urged admitted abusers to quietly resign — and then helped cover their tracks with bogus explanations for their departures.

https://www.latimes.com/california/stor ... bankruptcy

The silver lining to being a female who was not genetically qualified to participate in LDS scouting is that I avoided, apparently, a minefield of sexual abuse that was far, far too common for LDS boys.

[Doctor CamNC4Me]

Ugh. This is heartbreaking, first for the victims, and then in a very distant second for those of us that had incredible life-enhancing experiences through the BSA. The Church leaving the BSA now makes sense.

- Doc

[Res Ipsa]

I was in an LDS troop. We had no instruction about grooming or molestation. The subject was never discussed.

I’ve had the insurance part of a couple cases involving molestation by youth pastors. It’s amazing how they can manipulate young people.

[huckelberry]

I am curious about how this works. My memory of scouting was there was no occasion I can remember where we were alone and vulnerable to a predatory leader. So how did this work in those places there was a problem? I was unaware of any problem happening.In an LDS setting how did a leader bypass the lengthy teaching scouts receive in the church about making responsible decisions resisting improper sexual activity.

I am happy to share what I can, but first, could you clarify what you mean by "the lengthy teaching scouts receive in the church about making responsible decisions resisting improper sexual activity"?

If you are referring to the 'little factory' and 'licked cupcake' lectures youth received, I don't see how that would have any impact on unsupervised and unmonitored leaders' or older youth's behavior during scout activities, overnights, camp and jamboree events. As for extensive training or background checks, it is my understanding the LDS church did not appropriately engage in protective measures. The LDS church continues to object to even the most basic of protective measures for those who volunteer with children and youth. The most significant policy involves a 'hotline' that bishops can call, that clearly is intended primarily to protect the reputation and financial position of the LDS church, not the welfare of the youth involved.

In any case, the sheer number of cases reported indicates the LDS church, a hugely significant bsa participant, had a problem:
..........

The silver lining to being a female who was not genetically qualified to participate in LDS scouting is that I avoided, apparently, a minefield of sexual abuse that was far, far too common for LDS boys.

Lem, I found myself initially baffled as to why you would question my comment about LDS males instruction of self responsibility over sexual activity. Such matters would be discussed in priesthood meeting not so much scouts. Matters of basketball were more a concern with scout meetings. I agree with Doc here, my experiences with scouts were positive and the matter of sexual predation is utterly outside of my experience. In fact positive camping experiences are some of the few positive memories I have of the LDS church.

I asked about the practical procedure problem because I cannot see how a comp experience would leave a scout vulnerable. The leader is completely outnumbered and only has partial contruol of any of the event. I would expect that isolation from the group would be necessary for sexual predation.

I would not say that I do not believe that problem could happen, clearly there is evidence that it did though your comment about because there were lots of LDS scout groups then the LDS scout groups must of been involved does not hold logically. A more careful comment would be some LDS groups may have been involved.

For protection of youth it is important to look at that question of how these things were done when they were done. Organizations need to have a clear understanding of where danger points lie. Youth need to have clear understanding of where danger points lie.

I could note that my training as a youth did not include much in the way of tactical warnings.It was more general and focused upon taking individual responsibility, respecting yourself and others. I actually think those basic instructions have served me in a positive way. They are part(along with scouting) of the limited package of things from my Mormon upbringing that I hold in a positive light. But Lem you presented a bit of a puzzle for me. I am a bit older and little factories and licked cupcakes played not memorable role in the teaching I received. From the references to these ways of teaching I have heard I do wonder if they do a much inferior job of teaching making wise moral decisions with your own responsibility and free agency.