Waves of Pain and Sadness

[_Meadowchik]

It's just a thing that seems little but isn't quite so. A couple months ago, my older brother sent a quick email declaring that he would be "unfollowing" me on social media, because of the venom I express for the church and religion. I replied and we had a back-and-forth that ended with me saying I was sad such a topic should come between us.

On that platform, I never directly bash the church on my timeline. I have been critical on posts of other people who welcomed such discussion. I did share a post critical of people who seemed to treat some political issues religiously, but it certainly wasn't directed at him.

I tried to explain this, but he framed my criticism of religion and Mormonism in parallel conversations as a personal attack on him, as meaning that I "hate" him and his family.

This brother is very intelligent and very philosophical in his views. When I first told him how my beliefs changed, when he and his wife initiated the discussion, I provided almost no details. He said he didn't even know what "the church is true means," and proceeded to explain that he still attends mostly for the sense of spirituality he feels at church.

I live across the ocean, I see my family rarely. My brother ignoring me on social media is essentially him shutting me out of his life. It is painful. It came as a complete shock, too. I would have thought that he could maintain a boundary between his own identity and how I feel about the church, especially given his own ambivalence about the church.

I am in pain and I am disgusted. This comes is waves, though. I should feel better soon.

[_Res Ipsa]

Ah, Meadowchick, I’m so sorry that this has happened. I think his reaction is understandable, but that doesn’t make it any less sad. We try to carefully distinguish between ideas and people, but in the real world, people’s identity and their ideas are inextricably entertained. In practice, criticism of core ideas will feel like criticism of the self.

It is possible to get past it, but I think it takes time. I had a long talk with a cousin a couple of years ago. She was feeling her daughter’s rejection of Mormonism as a rejection of her. At some point in the conversation, she said something like, “oh, so she doesn’t see herself as rejecting me. That little bit of empathy was enough for her and her daughter to start building bridges and she says that their relationship is much improved.

I wish I knew what about our conversation opened up enough space to allow some healing. I’d bottle and sell it.

[_Philo Sofee]

I also empathsize with you Meadowchik. It is the same more or less in my family as well.

[_Jersey Girl]

I live across the ocean, I see my family rarely. My brother ignoring me on social media is essentially him shutting me out of his life. It is painful. It came as a complete shock, too. I would have thought that he could maintain a boundary between his own identity and how I feel about the church, especially given his own ambivalence about the church.

If you don't mind some feed back from a Never, I'd like to share my thoughts on the above and you probably already know these things, but still I'd like to put them on this thread as a reminder if a reminder is needed.

Based on 18 years online, interacting with and observing exiting/doubting LDS as well as TBM's, and also having had some doubting folks (including a Bishop and apologists, to show how deep this goes) correspond with me as an outlet mainly because I can do nothing to hurt them, I think for the majority of LDS (be they TBM, doubting, exiting, or ambivalent as is your brother) being Mormon is an essential feature of one's self image, self identity and sense of self worth, to the point where particularly if one is BIC, it's in your DNA. It runs through your blood stream, it's embedded in your brain. It's behind your eyes as you open them and view and interact with the world each day. It is who and what you are.

All of the lessons learned from childhood and beyond, are there in the forefront, in the very core of your being, in the back of your mind and they color your very thoughts.

It is frightening as hell for LDS who are doubting. They still worry about their eternal destination, they worry about not being authentic when at the same time, authenticity could easily cost them their marriage, their children, their extended family, their social circle, their standing in the community where they live, and even their business connections.

Maybe, just maybe, even though your brother is ambivalent about church, he still might have that feeling in his very bones that he needs to reject you in a sense--because you have rejected the church...because breaking free as you have, scares the living hell out of him for all the above reasons that I stated, so he feels a need to "keep one foot in the door" on account of it.

I'm so sorry you are going through this. When I left my own SB church (it had nothing to do with my God belief, it had to do with the people there) I simply walked out the door one day never to return. No deacons or pastors or church friends called me to try to find out why I disappeared. When I see any of these folks in public these days, we still hug each other and catch up on our families--they don't care if I left that particular church. They love me, I love them.

But for LDS, the choices of one have the capacity (in a sense) to affect the eternal destinations of all and if nothing else, the belief in eternal family runs so deep at the core of the LDS believing mind that when one walks out the door--they easily have lost their loved ones "for time".

The hurt and fear are astounding. The efforts on the part of church members to retrieve or reject the lost sheep are likewise astounding.

I think your brother needs to keep that one foot in the door. I'm sorry that he has shut you out. I hope one day and having learned through experiences, he will choose otherwise and open that door back up again.

[_candygal]

It is not a little thing. I am so sorry. It sounds like in your conversation with your brother, you tried hard to explain. Your high road will someday be rewarded. Just know that I admire your integrity in being true to yourself. Maybe someday...he will turn to you for some answers.

May the waves roll in and roll out quickly..while time brings you a knowing peace as you go about being and enjoying a process of learning and growing. I feel bad for members of my family who no longer want to associate. They are so stunted.

Peace with you.

[_Meadowchik]

When he said I hate Mormons and religious people, it was incredible to me. He hadn't bothered to engage with me about any of the the things I said that bothered him.

If he had, he might have heard that our family in my home is mixed faith, that we told all of our children they can choose their own beliefs, that one is still believing and we support him. It is so ironic to hear his accusations when I am the mom at seminary translating from French to English for my teen son, as accurately as I can, including scriptures that place me among the wicked and abominable. I love my son and have faith that love is stronger than our differences and am going on this road with him.

I suppose I thought my brother could do that. I hope he does come around.

[_Meadowchik]

Jersey he has always been a melancholy sort. He is genius or near genius in intelligence. I wonder if the implicit arrogance of the "one true church" contributes to that melancholy, because he must easily see the goodness in the world. Anyway, I suspect that as his children mature, he may face challenges bigger than my apostasy but similar. I think it is harder and harder for LDS families who try to raise super-rational children to maintain retention through adulthood. They do their job too well and, internet.

[_Meadowchik]

And thank you Res, Philo, Jersey, and Candy. It helps to know I've been heard and understood.

[_Meadowchik]

Another separate reply for another thought: my condolences to all of you who have felt the rejection of family and tribe. I know others have suffered much worse than me.

[_deacon blues]

Another separate reply for another thought: my condolences to all of you who have felt the rejection of family and tribe. I know others have suffered much worse than me.

Condolences to you, Meadowchik. So far, I have not had to go through an experience such as your recent experience with your brother. Still, I have a feeling that out of the blue the other shoe could drop, and I could get banished, disinherited, or just really chewed out. Ride the waves, and things will probably get better.