LDS Missionary held on rape charges

[Moksha]

With the police being called immediately, Kirton McConkie and the local bishop were not able to swing into action and hush things up.

The MD&D board is leaving open the possibility that the victim is making the whole thing up.

[drumdude]

With the police being called immediately, Kirton McConkie and the local bishop were not able to swing into action and hush things up.

The MD&D board is leaving open the possibility that the victim is making the whole thing up.

What a lovely bunch of Mormons they are…

[Marcus]

With the police being called immediately, Kirton McConkie and the local bishop were not able to swing into action and hush things up.

The MD&D board is leaving open the possibility that the victim is making the whole thing up.

Only one is really pushing that and he sounds pretty dusgusting already. Calm is solidly disagreeing.

5 hours ago, LoudmouthMormon said:
Thousands of times, every year. Thousands of mostly men are victimized this way, every year

What is really, really tragic and horrendous is there are so many actual assaults that the quite rare false, malicious claims that get taken seriously amount to thousands.

While I feel bad for the men falsely accused and what happened to them is a tragedy and violation, I feel worse for the hundreds of thousands and more actual victims of sexual assault.

But this, by same guy:

ZealouslyStriving
Posted 3 hours ago
Please, keep in mind that when someone is initially charged they load on all sorts of scary sounding charges. It puts the defendant in the position to be so fearful of being found guilty of all the charges and the years and years in prison that they are more likely to take a plea deal.

A detail I noticed is people walked in on them. I think it's possible she was ashamed of being inappropriate with an Elder, panicked and came up with a story to save face.

Either way, I hope the truth comes out, he is helped to repent and not treated like a leper, and she receives whatever counseling she may need.

A rapist needs jail, a victim needs justice. This just sounds like a Kirton-McConkie rep swinging into action. Disgusting.

[Imwashingmypirate]

With the police being called immediately, Kirton McConkie and the local bishop were not able to swing into action and hush things up.

The MD&D board is leaving open the possibility that the victim is making the whole thing up.

Only one is really pushing that and he sounds pretty dusgusting already. Calm is solidly disagreeing.

What is really, really tragic and horrendous is there are so many actual assaults that the quite rare false, malicious claims that get taken seriously amount to thousands.

While I feel bad for the men falsely accused and what happened to them is a tragedy and violation, I feel worse for the hundreds of thousands and more actual victims of sexual assault.

But this, by same guy:

ZealouslyStriving
Posted 3 hours ago
Please, keep in mind that when someone is initially charged they load on all sorts of scary sounding charges. It puts the defendant in the position to be so fearful of being found guilty of all the charges and the years and years in prison that they are more likely to take a plea deal.

A detail I noticed is people walked in on them. I think it's possible she was ashamed of being inappropriate with an Elder, panicked and came up with a story to save face.

Either way, I hope the truth comes out, he is helped to repent and not treated like a leper, and she receives whatever counseling she may need.

A rapist needs jail, a victim needs justice. This just sounds like a Kirton-McConkie rep swinging into action. Disgusting.

Sounds like this person might be talking from experience.

I would not automatically assume a victim is lying. Never. I agree it happens and some men have to live with the consequences of women making it up. But the last sentence is worrying.

They will be able to tell. Because it reads so forceful that there may be a chance of bruising. Especially in the roof of her mouth. The witnesses would have heard the struggle. Hopefully justice is served appropriately.

[I Have Questions]

Do we really blame the church for the choices of this man? There are plenty of missionaries who don't find themselves wanting to rape women. I think we risk not holding him entirely accountable for his behaviour if we give him excuses and blame the church. We all know that rape is wrong. The statement makes it clear that she did not consent. I don't know why he is being charged with sodomy when the statement doesn't say that. But that's irrelevant. Poor woman. I hope she can find strength and heal.

Edit, correction.

My thought on this is around the church claiming special powers of discernment when assigning people to positions. In the case of missionaries here’s how that happens:

An Apostle looks into each missionary’s eyes and receives revelation about where to assign him or her.

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/stu ... d?lang=eng

So I’m interested in understanding more about the alleged perpetrator’s background - does he have a history of this kind of behaviour, etc.? Because if so, the Apostle should have picked it up with those special powers of discernment and through the claimed revelation that goes with every missionary assignment.

In response to the person on MD&D saying he’s innocent and the victim might be lying - the missionary admitted to the behaviour, he just claims it was consensual. The behaviour he admits to warrants excommunication even if it was consensual. I also note the reports haven’t mentioned the age of the victim - so she could be below the age of consent.

[Dr. Shades]

I don't know why he is being charged with sodomy when the statement doesn't say that.

That's because according to Utah law, "sodomy" is the penile penetration of any bodily orifice other than the vagina. The mouth, in this case.

[Imwashingmypirate]

I don't know why he is being charged with sodomy when the statement doesn't say that.

That's because according to Utah law, "sodomy" is the penile penetration of any bodily orifice other than the vagina. The mouth, in this case.

Ohhhhhh. I see. Thanks for explaining. That makes sense.

[Imwashingmypirate]

Do we really blame the church for the choices of this man? There are plenty of missionaries who don't find themselves wanting to rape women. I think we risk not holding him entirely accountable for his behaviour if we give him excuses and blame the church. We all know that rape is wrong. The statement makes it clear that she did not consent. I don't know why he is being charged with sodomy when the statement doesn't say that. But that's irrelevant. Poor woman. I hope she can find strength and heal.

Edit, correction.

My thought on this is around the church claiming special powers of discernment when assigning people to positions. In the case of missionaries here’s how that happens:

An Apostle looks into each missionary’s eyes and receives revelation about where to assign him or her.

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/stu ... d?lang=eng

So I’m interested in understanding more about the alleged perpetrator’s background - does he have a history of this kind of behaviour, etc.? Because if so, the Apostle should have picked it up with those special powers of discernment and through the claimed revelation that goes with every missionary assignment.

In response to the person on MD&D saying he’s innocent and the victim might be lying - the missionary admitted to the behaviour, he just claims it was consensual. The behaviour he admits to warrants excommunication even if it was consensual. I also note the reports haven’t mentioned the age of the victim - so she could be below the age of consent.

I agree. His background would be important. I imagine that people who get to the point of full blown rape likely have attempted "smaller" similar things and build up to that. I honestly don't believe the church is the problem. I think people who are capable of such crimes have this nature in their core. But I do know people like to take opportunities to have a poke at the church. Doesn't bother me but I wouldn't like someone who commits a crime try to justify their actions by saying it's the church they grew up in that caused it. Clearly if he is happy to rape someone he isn't worried about the law of chastity and so probably wouldn't have been worried about it prior to serving a mission so he likely hasn't been refraining himself to follow the church commands if he is capable of that.

[Imwashingmypirate]

Do we really blame the church for the choices of this man? There are plenty of missionaries who don't find themselves wanting to rape women. I think we risk not holding him entirely accountable for his behaviour if we give him excuses and blame the church. We all know that rape is wrong. The statement makes it clear that she did not consent. I don't know why he is being charged with sodomy when the statement doesn't say that. But that's irrelevant. Poor woman. I hope she can find strength and heal.

Edit, correction.

My thought on this is around the church claiming special powers of discernment when assigning people to positions. In the case of missionaries here’s how that happens:

An Apostle looks into each missionary’s eyes and receives revelation about where to assign him or her.

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/stu ... d?lang=eng

So I’m interested in understanding more about the alleged perpetrator’s background - does he have a history of this kind of behaviour, etc.? Because if so, the Apostle should have picked it up with those special powers of discernment and through the claimed revelation that goes with every missionary assignment.

In response to the person on MD&D saying he’s innocent and the victim might be lying - the missionary admitted to the behaviour, he just claims it was consensual. The behaviour he admits to warrants excommunication even if it was consensual. I also note the reports haven’t mentioned the age of the victim - so she could be below the age of consent.

Does the prophet look prospective missionaries in the eye? I thought it was done by mail.

[I Have Questions]

Does the prophet look prospective missionaries in the eye? I thought it was done by mail.

The Apostles take turns in front of a computer screen with an image of each Missionary in front of them. They then receive divine revelation and inspiration about that missionary and about where to assign them. Or so they claim.