Elder Robert C. Gay Uses The Priesthood To Resurrect A Gnat He Had Just Murdered

[bbbbbbb]

The Pew Intercessory Prayer study showed prayer makes patients worse. That isn't a gross generalization. But of course you would say God hides in the trees during the study. Or God needed that person so he refused the blessing of healing.

I did some reading.

Aviles et al.[34] examined cardiovascular outcomes related to prayer. In this study, 799 coronary care unit patients at discharge were randomized to intercessory prayer or no prayer conditions. Prayer was conducted by five persons per patient at least once a week for 26 weeks.
Patients were considered to belong to a high-risk group if they were 70 years old or older or if they had any of the following: diabetes mellitus, previous myocardial infarction, cerebrovascular disease or peripheral vascular disease. The primary endpoint of the study was any of the following: death, cardiac arrest, rehospitalization for cardiovascular disease, coronary revascularization or an emergency department visit for cardiovascular disease.
By the end of 26 weeks, a primary endpoint had occurred in 25.6% of patients in the prayer group and in 29.3% of patients in the control group. The difference was not statistically significant. The results remained nonsignificant when data were analyzed separately for high- and low-risk patients. Thus, this study showed that, as delivered in this study, intercessory prayer did not influence the 26-week outcome after discharge from a coronary care unit.

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC2802370/

Elder Bednar would claim that those cardiovascular patients had immense faith not to be healed by prayer.

Benson et al.[37] described a triple-blind, randomized controlled study that examined whether remote intercessory prayer influenced recovery after coronary artery bypass graft surgery and whether the certainty of being prayed for was associated with better outcomes. The sample comprised 1,802 patients in six hospitals in the USA. These patients were randomized into three groups: 604 were prayed for after being informed that they may or may not be prayed for, 597 were not prayed for after similarly being informed that they may or may not be prayed for and 601 were prayed for after being informed they would definitely be prayed for.
Prayer commenced one day before the surgery and continued for 14 days. Three mainstream religious sites prayed daily for patients assigned to receive prayer. Assessment of outcomes was made by nurses who were blind to the group assignments. The primary outcome was the presence of any complication within 30 days of surgery. Secondary outcomes were any major event, including death. The study sought to examine the efficacy of intercessory prayer and not to test the presence of God. The design was described by Dusek et al.[38]
In the two groups that did not know for certain whether or not they were being prayed for, complications occurred in 52% of patients who received intercessory prayer and in 51% of those who did not. In contrast, complications occurred in a significantly larger proportion of patients (59%) who knew for certain that they were being prayed for. Major events and 30-day mortality rates, however, were similar across the three groups.
This study therefore showed that remote intercessory prayer did not improve outcomes after coronary artery bypass graft surgery. In fact, the knowledge of being prayed for was associated with a slightly but significantly higher rate of postsurgical complications.

The key to these studies is to remove the ability for retrospectively drawing selected targets around where some specific and carefully chosen arrows fell, whilst ignoring everything else.

What Mormons tend to do, particularly the leadership, is to find an example that seemingly fits what they want to believe - in this case find someone that recovered that was also prayed for, ignore any and all other evidences and implications, and claim that prayer heals.

If the senior church leaders (the Apostles) truly believed they held the power to heal the sick, they’d have spent their time during the COVID pandemic in hospitals giving blessings and offering prayers, instead of what they actually did which was to hide away in isolation in fear they were going to catch it and die. They’d have ‘put their money where their mouth was’. But they didn’t. Because when push comes to shove, they know that what they’re selling is just snake oil.

Perhaps the Apostles had great faith not to expose themselves to COVID.

[I Have Questions]

I did some reading.

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC2802370/

Elder Bednar would claim that those cardiovascular patients had immense faith not to be healed by prayer.

The key to these studies is to remove the ability for retrospectively drawing selected targets around where some specific and carefully chosen arrows fell, whilst ignoring everything else.

What Mormons tend to do, particularly the leadership, is to find an example that seemingly fits what they want to believe - in this case find someone that recovered that was also prayed for, ignore any and all other evidences and implications, and claim that prayer heals.

If the senior church leaders (the Apostles) truly believed they held the power to heal the sick, they’d have spent their time during the COVID pandemic in hospitals giving blessings and offering prayers, instead of what they actually did which was to hide away in isolation in fear they were going to catch it and die. They’d have ‘put their money where their mouth was’. But they didn’t. Because when push comes to shove, they know that what they’re selling is just snake oil.

Perhaps the Apostles had great faith not to expose themselves to COVID.

The Apostles also demonstrate they have the faith to not trust the members with an honest and full disclosure of the Church's finances, because they are concerned that the members do not have the faith to hear it.

An Apostle's faith is a fickle beast.

[Rivendale]

The Pew Intercessory Prayer study showed prayer makes patients worse. That isn't a gross generalization. But of course you would say God hides in the trees during the study. Or God needed that person so he refused the blessing of healing.

Somehow that just does not make any sense unless it means prayer instead of medical care and proper Health activities. Otherwise a skeptic would expect no change.

What dosen't make sense? It was a study done by the Templeton Foundation (not Pew). They are a religious organization they weren't critics.

[bbbbbbb]

I did some reading.

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC2802370/

Elder Bednar would claim that those cardiovascular patients had immense faith not to be healed by prayer.

The key to these studies is to remove the ability for retrospectively drawing selected targets around where some specific and carefully chosen arrows fell, whilst ignoring everything else.

What Mormons tend to do, particularly the leadership, is to find an example that seemingly fits what they want to believe - in this case find someone that recovered that was also prayed for, ignore any and all other evidences and implications, and claim that prayer heals.

If the senior church leaders (the Apostles) truly believed they held the power to heal the sick, they’d have spent their time during the COVID pandemic in hospitals giving blessings and offering prayers, instead of what they actually did which was to hide away in isolation in fear they were going to catch it and die. They’d have ‘put their money where their mouth was’. But they didn’t. Because when push comes to shove, they know that what they’re selling is just snake oil.

Perhaps the Apostles had great faith not to expose themselves to COVID.

Indeed.

[MG 2.0]

Perhaps the Apostles had great faith not to expose themselves to COVID.

The Apostles also demonstrate they have the faith to not trust the members with an honest and full disclosure of the Church's finances, because they are concerned that the members do not have the faith to hear it.

An Apostle's faith is a fickle beast.

I don't think that's actually the role of an apostle.

Their responsibility is to testify of the living Christ.

Are you with them on that?

By the way, what little respect I had for you has been severely diminished after my experience with you on another thread.

Just sayin'.

Regards,
MG

[Marcus]

Maybe it was a DezGnat.

I think it is hard to see how to respond to that odd story. Perhaps physics guy's comment is about as correct as one can get.

[I Have Questions]

I wonder if Elder Gay actually thinks he literally resurrected a dead gnat?

[Kishkumen]

I wonder if Elder Gay actually thinks he literally resurrected a dead gnat?

It was God who resurrected the gnat, IHAQ. Elder Gay was just a tool in God's hands.

[I Have Questions]

Why didn’t Elder Gnatman use his powers to save Mia Love? Why didn’t any of the Apostles attempt to heal her with their Priesthood?

[MsJack]

Why didn’t Elder Gnatman use his powers to save Mia Love? Why didn’t any of the Apostles attempt to heal her with their Priesthood?

Not just this, but wasn't there an apostle who told a story about a guy with cancer who was happy and excited that he was going to meet an apostle because he was sure he would be healed? I seem to remember it was presented as if the man were arrogant and presumptuous to think that.

I actually think the gnat story would be sweet coming from an average ward member. Coming from someone who claims apostolic power and abilities, it's a head-scratcher.

Anyhow, RIP Mia Love. I would not wish brain cancer on anyone.