Steel in America during the time of the Book of Mormon

[_Fortigurn]

I think you can add to your signature "grampa75 X 1"

Good point.

[_Runtu]

I think you can add to your signature "grampa75 X 1"

Good point.

I thought it was just those of us who don't believe who are lazy researchers.

[_Mercury]

Did the people living in the Americas at the time the Book of Mormon was being written by the American prophets, have steel as it was written in the Book of Mormon when Nephi broke his bow of steel.
Anyone who doubts that steel existed during those times must not be well read in the scriptures.
The time that it was written in the Book of Mormon that Nephi broke his bow of steel was about 600 BC. But about 1000 BC this verse is written in the Bible concerning steel weapons.

2 Samuel 22: 35 He teacheth my hands to war; so that a bow of steel is broken in mine arms.
There is one other things that tends to prove the validity of the Book of Mormon is when Lehi, after having marched for three days from Jerusalem camped by the borders of the Red Sea. He named a river that flowed into the Red Sea after one of his son. And named a valley which was by the river that flowed into the Red Sea after his other son. The problem with that verse is that the Red Sea is over 200 miles from Jerusalem and could not be reached in only 3 days. The Red Sea is situated in a volcanic mountain and is fed from underground. In the entire history of Israel (until 1963) there was never a river that flowed into the Red Sea.
In the Book of Josephus, which was published in the United States in 1963 we find this verse:

The Tigres, the Phison (Which is now called the Ganges) and the Euphrates flowed into the Red Sea.

There is a footnote after that 3rd verse on page 25 in the book called Antiquities of the Jews that reads: (here is not only the South Sea which alone we call by that name today, but all the water surrounding Israel up to the East Indies were called the Red Sea.)

Joseph Smith had no way of knowing that there was a river that flowed into the Red Sea because that information was not known to anyone at the time of Joseph Smith. So wouldn't you say that Joseph Smith had to be inspired of God to know that a river flowed into the Red Sea when the world believed that there was never a river that flowed into the Red Sea.

Just wondering how others would take that information.
grampa75

There has never been any steel excavated from the americas nor has there EVER been any means of production elements in the new world prior to the Europeans bringing it to the Americas.

It is assisnine and ignorant to believe the Bible, let alone the Book of Mormon to be a method of validating the truth claims of an even more assinine document.

Do your homework and get back to me before making an even bigger ass out of yourself.

[_Mr. Coffee]

I think the best rebuttle of some of the wild claims in the Book of Mormon (Steel in ancient meso-america, certain kinds of grains mentioned, the use of chariots, ect.) was Frank Zindler's How Do You Lose A Steel Mill".

And the missionaries wonder why I start giggling uncontrolably whenever the show up at my front porch...

[_Mephitus]

Hey Mr Coffee, thanks for the link. that's an awesome article, i especialy love this referance i had forgotten which trumps the debate on "was it steel or bronze or some other metal?"

And I [Nephi] did teach my people to build buildings, and to work in all manner of wood, and of iron, and of copper, and of brass, and of steel, and of gold, and of silver, and of precious ores, which were in great abundance. (2 Nephi 5:15)

[_Fortigurn]

Hey Mr Coffee, thanks for the link. that's an awesome article, i especialy love this referance i had forgotten which trumps the debate on "was it steel or bronze or some other metal?"

And I [Nephi] did teach my people to build buildings, and to work in all manner of wood, and of iron, and of copper, and of brass, and of steel, and of gold, and of silver, and of precious ores, which were in great abundance. (2 Nephi 5:15)

An excellent point.

[_Mercury]

I think the best rebuttle of some of the wild claims in the Book of Mormon (Steel in ancient meso-america, certain kinds of grains mentioned, the use of chariots, ect.) was Frank Zindler's How Do You Lose A Steel Mill".

And the missionaries wonder why I start giggling uncontrolably whenever the show up at my front porch...

OMFG I about choked hen I saw your avatar

[_grampa75]

I don't understand your question. You seem to ask whether or not steel existed in ancient America during the Book of Mormon time period, but the "evidence" you cite is a scripture from the Old World.

I was using a scripture from the Old Testament to establish the fact that steel was in existence long before it was written about in the Book of Mormon. If they had steel in Israel in 1000 BC it just stands to reason that the method of making that steel would have been taken with those who came to America.

[_grampa75]

I don't know about that, gramps, but I do know that no steel existed in ancient America during the Book of Mormon time frame. No metallurgy existed at all during that time frame in ancient America. They knew how to work with metal outcrops, but no metallurgy, which the Book of Mormon clearly describes.

I don't understand your logic on that subject. If steel was invented 1000 BC, it just stands to reason that the knowledge of how to make steel would be brought with those from the old world.
I know that they have found some ancient metal that was used in sugery and other things. It was discoverd that the metal was a hardened copper. It was so hard that it could actually cut our tungston. That metal might have been called steel by the inhabitants of ancient america. That part I don't believe anyone can be sure of.

[_Bond...James Bond]

I was using a scripture from the Old Testament to establish the fact that steel was in existence long before it was written about in the Book of Mormon. If they had steel in Israel in 1000 BC it just stands to reason that the method of making that steel would have been taken with those who came to America.

1) Steel wasn't around circa 1000 BC. The best they had was iron.

2) There is no evidence for steel in the New World (including steel production).

I don't understand your logic on that subject. If steel was invented 1000 BC, it just stands to reason that the knowledge of how to make steel would be brought with those from the old world.
I know that they have found some ancient metal that was used in sugery and other things. It was discoverd that the metal was a hardened copper. It was so hard that it could actually cut our tungston. That metal might have been called steel by the inhabitants of ancient america. That part I don't believe anyone can be sure of.

1) It's a long way from copper to steel.

2) There are these people called scientists. They are often smart due to many years of study. Often these scientists dig into the ground (often in MesoAmerica). These scientists can analyze stuff they find. They haven't found any steel!!!!