Runtu wrote:But I thought I'd throw this out: is church doctrine evolving with time?
Of course it is. Witness the church's official site referring people to FARMS's website for DNA/Lamanite information for all the proof you need of that.
Some people believe that certain "embarrassing" doctrines have been downplayed or blurred, but do you see continuing doctrinal change?
Of course. Witness the rise of Internet Mormonism and how the church hasn't come out and denounced it (yet?).
And if so, is this a good thing?
It all depends on what you want. If you want an easy religion that you don't have to be embarrassed about, then it's great. If you want a religion that teaches the truth of God with precision and exactness, then it's not good at all.
"Finally, for your rather strange idea that miracles are somehow linked to the amount of gay sexual gratification that is taking place would require that primitive Christianity was launched by gay sex, would it not?"
harmony wrote:That is why I am leery of everyone else's revelations. Including prophets', apostles', and assorted other church leaders'. I have yet to see any revelation that is more appropriate for me than my own. And because I refuse to allow anyone else to tell me what is best for me, I am called apostate by some, and wise by others. Go figure.
OMG, I love you... I have argued this many times. The prophet and church authorities receive revelation for themselves and that which they govern, but the DO NOT receive it for others. God speaks to us about our own revelations.
Nephi, if the above OMG is short for OH MY GOD, you need to speak with the resident Bishop Peterson, as that is a sin for Mormons.
Runtu, Ahhh yes, TSCC is a chameleon crawling upon society, leaving a slimy trail behind.
Nehor When they declare direct doctrine I listen for confirmation from the Spirit.
Assuming that 100 staunch LDS, say folks with TRs, listen for confirmation from the Spirit about a declaration of direct doctrine, will they all get the same answer?
Lies always grow in the telling, so yes. The church is definitely evolving. Brigham Young would scream blood atonement for a great deal of the membership of the "mainstream" church today.
And crawling on the planet's face Some insects called the human race Lost in time And lost in space...and meaning
I think church doctrine is devolving, rather than evolving. It's getting to be less and less, almost as if the unique doctrines of the LDS church are disappearing. Adam-God? We don't teach that. Man progressing to Gods? We don't teach that. Eternal polygamy? We don't teach that. We don't teach much of anything that's unique anymore, except the stuff that doesn't matter in the eternities: what you ate, what you drank, how many earrings you had, what color your shirt was on Sunday... We spend an inordinant amount of time bustling around the inconsequentials, very little time on the basics, absolutely no time on anything beyond the basics, and altogether too much time worrying about money and numbers.
harmony wrote:I think church doctrine is devolving, rather than evolving. It's getting to be less and less, almost as if the unique doctrines of the LDS church are disappearing. Adam-God? We don't teach that. Man progressing to Gods? We don't teach that. Eternal polygamy? We don't teach that. We don't teach much of anything that's unique anymore, except the stuff that doesn't matter in the eternities: what you ate, what you drank, how many earrings you had, what color your shirt was on Sunday... We spend an inordinant amount of time bustling around the inconsequentials, very little time on the basics, absolutely no time on anything beyond the basics, and altogether too much time worrying about money and numbers.
No offense to the masses, but I think this is a biproduct of the church becoming larger and larger. I think the church still believes in many of these ideas, but they do not "teach" them (ie, openly speak of them in church or public) because most people cannot grasp these concepts. The church has had to boil down to the lowest common denominator.
harmony wrote:That is why I am leery of everyone else's revelations. Including prophets', apostles', and assorted other church leaders'. I have yet to see any revelation that is more appropriate for me than my own. And because I refuse to allow anyone else to tell me what is best for me, I am called apostate by some, and wise by others. Go figure.
OMG, I love you...
Well, I appreciate the support. It's not the norm, although I get more here than I do elsewhere.
I have argued this many times. The prophet and church authorities receive revelation for themselves and that which they govern, but the DO NOT receive it for others. God speaks to us about our own revelations.
I've often said our leaders overstep their stewardship too often. They, like many others, don't take care of their own stewardship, and then they take on stewardship they have no business messing with. Altogether too much of our 'revelations' over the last 30 years are examples of our leaders meddling in things that are not their business. Which tells me that our leaders don't see any clearer than we do, and in some cases at least, see even less than we do. Perhaps their spiritual eyes are as clouded with spiritual cataracts (pride, ego, arrogance), but truly I've seen little that is useful in the last 3 decades.
harmony wrote:I think church doctrine is devolving, rather than evolving. It's getting to be less and less, almost as if the unique doctrines of the LDS church are disappearing. Adam-God? We don't teach that. Man progressing to Gods? We don't teach that. Eternal polygamy? We don't teach that. We don't teach much of anything that's unique anymore, except the stuff that doesn't matter in the eternities: what you ate, what you drank, how many earrings you had, what color your shirt was on Sunday... We spend an inordinant amount of time bustling around the inconsequentials, very little time on the basics, absolutely no time on anything beyond the basics, and altogether too much time worrying about money and numbers.
No offense to the masses, but I think this is a biproduct of the church becoming larger and larger. I think the church still believes in many of these ideas, but they do not "teach" them (ie, openly speak of them in church or public) because most people cannot grasp these concepts. The church has had to boil down to the lowest common denominator.
I think the reason we don't teach them anymore is because they make us look like fools. It has little to do with the ability of the members to grasp the concepts, and a great deal to do with explaining said concepts to a highly skeptical media.
That which made us unique (our doctrines, our out-spoken leaders, the differentness of our culture) is being shoved in the closet to make room for mainstreaming and political correctness. Our leaders are forced to lie, prevaricate, and spin rather than openly declare doctrine. Pres Benson was right; this church is under condemnation.
harmony wrote:I think church doctrine is devolving, rather than evolving. It's getting to be less and less, almost as if the unique doctrines of the LDS church are disappearing. Adam-God? We don't teach that. Man progressing to Gods? We don't teach that. Eternal polygamy? We don't teach that. We don't teach much of anything that's unique anymore, except the stuff that doesn't matter in the eternities: what you ate, what you drank, how many earrings you had, what color your shirt was on Sunday... We spend an inordinant amount of time bustling around the inconsequentials, very little time on the basics, absolutely no time on anything beyond the basics, and altogether too much time worrying about money and numbers.
No offense to the masses, but I think this is a biproduct of the church becoming larger and larger. I think the church still believes in many of these ideas, but they do not "teach" them (ie, openly speak of them in church or public) because most people cannot grasp these concepts. The church has had to boil down to the lowest common denominator.
The church is not growing. Spoken like a true sucker.
And crawling on the planet's face Some insects called the human race Lost in time And lost in space...and meaning
harmony wrote:I think church doctrine is devolving, rather than evolving. It's getting to be less and less, almost as if the unique doctrines of the LDS church are disappearing. Adam-God? We don't teach that. Man progressing to Gods? We don't teach that. Eternal polygamy? We don't teach that. We don't teach much of anything that's unique anymore, except the stuff that doesn't matter in the eternities: what you ate, what you drank, how many earrings you had, what color your shirt was on Sunday... We spend an inordinant amount of time bustling around the inconsequentials, very little time on the basics, absolutely no time on anything beyond the basics, and altogether too much time worrying about money and numbers.
No offense to the masses, but I think this is a biproduct of the church becoming larger and larger. I think the church still believes in many of these ideas, but they do not "teach" them (ie, openly speak of them in church or public) because most people cannot grasp these concepts. The church has had to boil down to the lowest common denominator.
The church is not growing. Spoken like a true sucker.
I never stipulated that the membership of the church is growing (you assumed that). I am stipulating that the church is growing in the eye of the world community. More people know of the church and are searching for what the church believes, but many cannot understand such concepts, and the media with which they gain this information is notorious for spinning the information that is given.