JonasS wrote:the road to hana wrote:p.s. pirate, I voted "other" because I believe you have mischaracterized mainstream Christian belief about original sin.
I would further add that the way I understand it, it is more synonymous with the LDS concept of "The Fall," which is simply a fall from grace, a state of being, and not an act. Since Mormons believe in The Fall, it seems to me the only reason they don't believe in original sin is because they misperceive it to be something different.
If the question above were phrased, "Do you believe that humans are born into a condition that includes death?" I would answer yes, and that more closely approximates how I understand the concept of "original sin."
Perhaps I understood wrong. I just assumed that the majority of Christians were mainstream.
I'm not exactly sure what "mainstream" means, really. There might be a stream, but some might be swimming upstream and some are swimming down.
Seriously, now I think the distinction to be made is what the
actual belief is, and what the members
believe it to be.
That happens even in Mormonism. There can be a belief, and it can be authoritatively or semi-officially perceived to be one way, but members might be confused in understanding or explaining it.
In Christianity, I think this happens a lot. Understanding of the trinity is just one example of that. Original sin is another.
When I asked the question, it was with reference to the links I provided from CARM.
I don't read CARM, so can't speak to it.
From my own undestanding, I thought that we were perfect as babies, but born into a sinful nature, that we had come from being perfect with God, into a world in which we have the capacity to sin and that we will automatically sin even if we try not to.
That's pretty close to my own understanding and what I understand mainstream Christian belief to be.
The key words there are "sinful nature." As I said before, I perceive those words to mean "as into a world where death exists, we are also born into a world where sin exists." Since Mormons believe that Satan/Lucifer was a fallen angel who fell down with a third of the hosts of heaven and that he has some influence on this world (if not dominion over it), it seems to me that Mormons are on the same page pretty much about that. That is, Mormons believe that all are born into a world where sin exists. I'm not aware of any Mormon belief that there is anyone who has escaped that, except Jesus Christ (Catholics believe Jesus' mother, Mary, escaped it, but generally most Christians just believe Jesus did).
So if "sinful nature" means predisposition to sin, or inclination to sin, or tendency to sin, I think that's the point that is argued. What it doesn't mean (which Mormons never do understand, and Joseph Smith got totally wrong) is that we are responsible for Adam's sin. I don't know any mainstream belief that holds that. I also don't know any mainstream Christian belief that holds that newborn babies are born "in sin." The distinction is that they are born "into sin," just like they are born "into mortality" and "into death." They are also born, generally, healthy, and are born "into the possibility of illness."
Does that make sense?