Santa vs. Jesus

The catch-all forum for general topics and debates. Minimal moderation. Rated PG to PG-13.
_Sethbag
_Emeritus
Posts: 6855
Joined: Thu Feb 22, 2007 10:52 am

Re: Santa vs. Jesus

Post by _Sethbag »

Dwight Frye wrote:
John Larsen wrote:I believe so. It is hard to go around chastising people for pushing myth as truth and then do the same yourself when you think it is fun to do so. My children have never believe Santa was real, but it has not diminished their joy or wonderment at the holiday season on bit.

I don't have kids yet, but, if I have it my way, I don't think I will teach them Santa is real. I would worry, though, about my kids letting the cat out of the bag and ruining it for other people's children, which I would make me feel horrible. John, have your kids been able to keep it a secret from other kids?


I wouldn't worry too much about it. Sometime between the age when a child first begins to think coherently at all, and about the age of what, nine(?), they all seem to figure out that Santa wasn't real. If your kid didn't let the cat out of the bag, someone else would, so I wouldn't feel too bad about it.

Personally, I don't see the harm in talking about Santa, and pretending that he's real. But I do see the harm in parents getting mad because someone told their kid that Santa wasn't real. It's like they think if nobody lets the cat out of the bag, their child will believe in Santa forever. There's nothing wrong with the collective decision to act (knowingly) as if Santa were real. If anything, being in on the big secret can make a kid feel more grown up, and then they can pretend on with gusto, like any of us.
Mormonism ceased being a compelling topic for me when I finally came to terms with its transformation from a personality cult into a combination of a real estate company, a SuperPac, and Westboro Baptist Church. - Kishkumen
_The Dude
_Emeritus
Posts: 2976
Joined: Wed Nov 01, 2006 3:16 am

Re: Santa vs. Jesus

Post by _The Dude »

Who Knows wrote:Am I wrong/hypocritical to tell my kids that Jesus (as recognized in the religious world) is a myth, but not do the same for santa?
.
.
.
.


It's a very small hypocrisy. Not enough to worry about.
"And yet another little spot is smoothed out of the echo chamber wall..." Bond
_John Larsen
_Emeritus
Posts: 1895
Joined: Fri Jan 12, 2007 7:16 pm

Re: Santa vs. Jesus

Post by _John Larsen »

Dwight Frye wrote:
John Larsen wrote:I believe so. It is hard to go around chastising people for pushing myth as truth and then do the same yourself when you think it is fun to do so. My children have never believe Santa was real, but it has not diminished their joy or wonderment at the holiday season on bit.

I don't have kids yet, but, if I have it my way, I don't think I will teach them Santa is real. I would worry, though, about my kids letting the cat out of the bag and ruining it for other people's children, which I would make me feel horrible. John, have your kids been able to keep it a secret from other kids?

We tell them not to, but I don't know exactly what they do when I am not around. I guess this is no different then everyone with "straight" kids has once they find out the big secret.
_John Larsen
_Emeritus
Posts: 1895
Joined: Fri Jan 12, 2007 7:16 pm

Re: Santa vs. Jesus

Post by _John Larsen »

It also has been useful when questions about Jesus come up, because we can just tell them that Jesus is like Santa--some people want to believe. They immediately get that.
_Ray A

Re: Santa vs. Jesus

Post by _Ray A »

Dwight Frye wrote:I don't have kids yet, but, if I have it my way, I don't think I will teach them Santa is real. I would worry, though, about my kids letting the cat out of the bag and ruining it for other people's children, which I would make me feel horrible. John, have your kids been able to keep it a secret from other kids?


Keep what secret? It's all actual history. Your kids-to-be deserve the truth. Here's a link supporting the existence of Santa, from the Foundation for Arctic, Reindeer, and Magical Snowmen:

Evidence Trending in Frosty’s Direction

Professor Runtu has ably demonstrated that the anti-Santa mob has an agenda. While I don't claim this as "proof", I'd say there's a 50-50 chance Santa is real.
_Trevor
_Emeritus
Posts: 7213
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2007 6:28 pm

Re: Santa vs. Jesus

Post by _Trevor »

I love that Santa vs. Jesus smackdown that South Park did. Brilliant.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tlDdNXE9VBE
“I was hooked from the start,” Snoop Dogg said. “We talked about the purpose of life, played Mousetrap, and ate brownies. The kids thought it was off the hook, for real.”
_Jersey Girl
_Emeritus
Posts: 34407
Joined: Wed Oct 25, 2006 1:16 am

Re: Santa vs. Jesus

Post by _Jersey Girl »

B23 wrote:I don't think so, sometimes the truth hurts. Although your kid will be the killjoy who tells all his little classmates the bad news. :wink:


Yes and you ought to be the teacher in the room who hears it!

Offtopic note. Anyone ever notice that you can rearrange the letters in "Santa" to form "Satan"?


A million years ago. *yawn*
Failure is not falling down but refusing to get up.
Chinese Proverb
_Jersey Girl
_Emeritus
Posts: 34407
Joined: Wed Oct 25, 2006 1:16 am

Re: Santa vs. Jesus

Post by _Jersey Girl »

I apologize in advance, but I just HAVE to add this to the thread because I think it's hysterical. Yes, I'm a little warped. Live with it!

http://www.landoverbaptist.org/news1299/santy.html
Failure is not falling down but refusing to get up.
Chinese Proverb
_Jersey Girl
_Emeritus
Posts: 34407
Joined: Wed Oct 25, 2006 1:16 am

Re: Santa vs. Jesus

Post by _Jersey Girl »

Who Knows wrote:Am I wrong/hypocritical to tell my kids that Jesus (as recognized in the religious world) is a myth, but not do the same for santa?
.
.
.
.


Well, yes, it would be hypocritical from an adult perspective. From a child's perspective? They wouldn't make that comparison to begin with.

I've taught young children for years professionally and also taught Sunday School in my former church. Whenever I posed the question to children in either setting (and only when children initiated the conversation), "What's Christmas?" Without fail, they would say it's about the gifts and Santa.

I think that if you want to rule out Jesus entirely from Christmas (how dare you :-) you could still present Santa as "playing the Santa game" and remain true to your (heathen) world view. In that way, you never have to worry that your children will one day realize that you weren't honest with them.

Except for the real fact that you're ripping off the birth of Christ to indulge your materialistic world view.

:-D

Children do not typically have a "light bulb" moment where they suddenly realize that there is no Santa. It's a process of realization that takes place over time where their cognitive development slowly brings about that awareness.

By all means do what you feel is right regarding Santa (Satan) and should you choose to tell your children outright that Santa does not exist, know that in order to keep them from telling their classmates (and placing their teacher in an awkward situation) you're going to ask your children to cooperate with a lie.

See how easy moral parenting is?

Ho Ho Ho,
Jersey Girl
Failure is not falling down but refusing to get up.
Chinese Proverb
_Ray A

Re: Santa vs. Jesus

Post by _Ray A »

Jersey Girl wrote:
Children do not typically have a "light bulb" moment where they suddenly realize that there is no Santa. It's a process of realization that takes place over time where their cognitive development slowly brings about that awareness.


That rings a bell. (It can happen to adults too.)


Jersey Girl wrote:Ho Ho Ho,


That too. (Post realisation)
Post Reply