Mitt Romney Gives Millions To Charity, Most To Mormon Church

[_Simon Belmont]

Should it be considered charitable if you are "forced" to do it.

I am a member in full standing and fellowship. I am forced to do nothing. No one I know in the church is forced to do anything. So just what is your point?

[_Doctor Scratch]

Should it be considered charitable if you are "forced" to do it.

I am a member in full standing and fellowship. I am forced to do nothing. No one I know in the church is forced to do anything. So just what is your point?

I've seen you make this point before, Simon, but I've always felt that it was pretty weak. How do you define "forced"? If you're told that you won't get into the upper echelons of heaven if you don't pay tithing... What is that? Or what if a parent threatens to take away privileges from a child who doesn't want to attend Church/seminary, etc?

Not long ago, one of my extremely TBM relatives told a story about a missionary-aged young man who didn't want to go on a mission. After putting up quite a stink, the young man's bishop eventually slapped this young man upside the head, knocking him to the floor. The bishop grabbed this young elder by the foot and dragged him into the bishop's office and had him sign the form for him to go on a mission. Apparently, the young man went on the mission, did as he was told, etc., and felt no resentment. Indeed, after finishing this story, my relative exclaimed, "That's one heck of a mission calling!"

Is that sort of thing kosher in your book?

[_harmony]

Apparently, the young man went on the mission, did as he was told, etc., and felt no resentment. Indeed, after finishing this story, my relative exclaimed, "That's one heck of a mission calling!"

Is that sort of thing kosher in your book?

That's not a mission calling; that's assault.

Sounds like a fairy tale to me.

[_Jason Bourne]

So it is legally a charity, according the US law, they have filed all the correct paper work.

Correct.

But...

Yeeeesssss.....

Are they a "charitable" organization? In the terms most people would think of a charitable organization.

I think the answer then would be no.

Well that depends whether one views religions as a charitable endeavor. There is no question that the LDS Church spends most, if not all its tithes on operating the religious activities of the Church. So is maintaining buildings for worship, providing manuals, youth programs, addiction recovery programs, spiritual counseling for members seeking it, marriage counseling for members receiving it, educating some members at a University, and so on charitable activities? I think so. I do not think giving all your money away to feed or clothe people is the only thing that is a charitable activity.

Oh and by the way the LDS Church does that too. It does feed, clothe and house the poor as well as provide medical care and aid in disasters both through is fast offering funds and its humanitarian aid funds. I know many here feel that the Church should do more in that area. They may be right. But it does do such things.

[_ajax18]

Is that sort of thing kosher in your book?

I guess that's what it would take. They can't really promise someone who chooses to serve a mission anything he would not be promised if he chose not to go. That was the first thing that disappointed me. So without a carrot, all that is left is the stick, and to brow beat those who don't want to go into submission. After understanding the mentality of the Mormon leadership I've met, that seems to be how it works. If someone doesn't want to do something they ask them to do, then they shame them or try to make them feel guilty for not doing it. I've heard bits of my own philosophy like, "you're losing blessings, or you're missing out yourself." But in general it seems to come down to guilt and shame. If the individual can blow off the guilt and shame and remain temple worthy, by Mormon doctrine he has as much right to any blessing or comfort he would have had if he would have completed the mission as given in the parable of the laborers.

That being said, I'd be amazed if Governor Romney was actually paying on his gross earnings. At his income level, I doubt I'd be able to do it.

[_jon]

So it is legally a charity, according the US law, they have filed all the correct paper work.

Correct.

But...

Yeeeesssss.....

Are they a "charitable" organization? In the terms most people would think of a charitable organization.

I think the answer then would be no.

Well that depends whether one views religions as a charitable endeavor. There is no question that the LDS Church spends most, if not all its tithes on operating the religious activities of the Church. So is maintaining buildings for worship, providing manuals, youth programs, addiction recovery programs, spiritual counseling for members seeking it, marriage counseling for members receiving it, educating some members at a University, and so on charitable activities? I think so. I do not think giving all your money away to feed or clothe people is the only thing that is a charitable activity.

Oh and by the way the LDS Church does that too. It does feed, clothe and house the poor as well as provide medical care and aid in disasters both through is fast offering funds and its humanitarian aid funds. I know many here feel that the Church should do more in that area. They may be right. But it does do such things.

Jason, where do you think the Church finds the money for building City Creek Mall?
I know nobody knows but I'm interested in where you think it comes from.

[_Yoda]

Jason, where do you think the Church finds the money for building City Creek Mall?
I know nobody knows but I'm interested in where you think it comes from.

I know you asked Jason, but my guess is that the money comes from dividends from prior investments made by the Church. The million dollar question is whether or not those funds can be considered tithing funds. My opinion is that, ultimately, the answer is yes, since all Church funding is based on member contributions, either directly, or indirectly.

[_Jason Bourne]

Jason, where do you think the Church finds the money for building City Creek Mall?
I know nobody knows but I'm interested in where you think it comes from.

Well as you note nobody other than the Church insiders know. I would say that they come from the for profit activities. But I am skeptical that given the rumors of the large cost over runs that the billions the project costs could be funded just from income or assets generated from the for profit businesses. But I do not know what kind of cash those businesses have accumulated over the years and/or paid in dividends to the LDS Church as the owners of the shares of those for profit companies. I also do not know how much debt is being uses to finance the project.

That said it would not startle me if tithing had been used for some of this project.