Is it possible to transcend the LDS Church?

[_Kishkumen]

If you think you there is a role for you within the community to bring something to it, then I don't think you need to "transcend" it. I don't like the idea of transcend, really, because it means one places one's self above the community in leaving it. It is an apples and oranges comparison. No community will ever satisfy us completely. A better question, in my view, is whether the community is the kind of place that can best utilize your talents, that can best help you grow, and to which you can make a valuable contribution. This is where I get stuck with Mormonism. I find it difficult to see myself as a happy member making a real contribution.

The Church, like a fast food corporation, has a very limited and constricting role carved out for me that I just don't like. I don't like crappy uniforms, lots of policies, endless meetings, and repetitive tasks. That's just me. Some people may really dig that.

[_consiglieri]

I don't know about Master Po blocking the exit but when you can take the pebble you get burned and thrown out into the cold.

I guess Master Po was kinda pissed.

[_consiglieri]

If you think you there is a role for you within the community to bring something to it, then I don't think you need to "transcend" it. I don't like the idea of transcend, really, because it means one places one's self above the community in leaving it. It is an apples and oranges comparison. No community will ever satisfy us completely. A better question, in my view, is whether the community is the kind of place that can best utilize your talents, that can best help you grow, and to which you can make a valuable contribution. This is where I get stuck with Mormonism. I find it difficult to see myself as a happy member making a real contribution.

The Church, like a fast food corporation, has a very limited and constricting role carved out for me that I just don't like. I don't like crappy uniforms, lots of policies, endless meetings, and repetitive tasks. That's just me. Some people may really dig that.

I adopt your definition of "transcend" and second your view on fast food corporations.

All the Best!

--Consiglieri

[_Juggler Vain]

Honestly, the most difficult part of attending is not that the lessons/talks have so little to offer, but that any input from me is clearly unwanted by the powers that be.

A common perspective, I think, which I share. Once attending LDS Church meetings started to feel like a supreme waste of time for me, it was over, even though I didn't know it right away. I've been in one of the most liberal wards in the Church, and the conscious efforts of the leaders there kept me involved for a while. Later, I was asked to serve in a bishopric, and having the ability to influence things at the local level (i.e., talk and lesson topics, hymn choices, meeting schedules, fast offering distribution, etc.) did not mitigate this problem, as having that vantage point only further exposed the systemic roots of the problem.

Bottom line, leaving solved this problem for me; staying didn't. But that might depend on who runs your ward.

-JV

[_madeleine]

When one has learned everything a given organization has to teach, what is the appropriate response?

In the grand tradition of Mormonism, create your own offshoot that has something new (revealed by God of course).

[_Yoda]

If you think you there is a role for you within the community to bring something to it, then I don't think you need to "transcend" it. I don't like the idea of transcend, really, because it means one places one's self above the community in leaving it. It is an apples and oranges comparison. No community will ever satisfy us completely. A better question, in my view, is whether the community is the kind of place that can best utilize your talents, that can best help you grow, and to which you can make a valuable contribution. This is where I get stuck with Mormonism. I find it difficult to see myself as a happy member making a real contribution.

The Church, like a fast food corporation, has a very limited and constricting role carved out for me that I just don't like. I don't like crappy uniforms, lots of policies, endless meetings, and repetitive tasks. That's just me. Some people may really dig that.

I really like Kish's view about transcending.

Even if you have learned everything there is to learn, can you still find value in the community itself, and bring value to others in the community? I think that if you can answer yes to both questions, you are in the right place.

I have found a nice spot for myself in my ward. I love playing the piano for Primary. It is fun and easy for me, since I have done it for such a long time. I enjoy interacting with the kids, and it is a great way to keep my accompaniment skills fresh. It is always different playing for a group than playing for my students' solos in the studio.

[_Tobin]

I think it is very important to transcend the LDS Church. I'm not saying one should cut yourself off from the members of the LDS Church, or from any other Church for that matter. I'm very happy to associate with any group of like-minded people that believe in God and discuss what his attributes may or may not be.

The problem with the LDS Church is that it holds you back. The cult of follow the leadership is troubling. That needs to be replaced with do what God tells you to do. The corporate nature is bothersome. They greatly sin by taking tithes and offerings and waste it in the ways they do. It is better to carefully and conscientiously employ your means to helping the poor and those in need as God gives you the best understanding to do so. And the list goes on.

Any Mormon (or for that matter true believer in God), should be dedicated to the truth, wherever that takes you. And nothing is more true that seeking and speaking with and doing what God wants you to do. When you are doing that, you really have transcended the LDS Church and joined the Church of God or Zion.

[_Analytics]

That is an awesome quote, Analytics.

Never did any passage of scripture come with more power into the heart of man than this did at this time into mine.

Do you have a source?

All the Best!

--Consiglieri

It's from Emerson's essay Self-Reliance.

If it rings to you, you won't regret reading the whole thing in context.

[_Kishkumen]

I'm not sure you ever can learn all there is to learn from any relationship. Sometimes what you learn isn't the intended lesson but it's valuable anyway and can even be meaningful.

In terms of the church specifically, I've come to appreciate what the Jesus taught in the first few verses of Matthew 23.

To His disciples and the multitude, He pointed out that the Pharisees and Scribes, for all that they got wrong, still had authority ("sit in Moses' seat"). He followed that with the injunction to observe and keep the teachings of these ecclesiastical leaders even if the leaders themselves did not do what they should.

If you believe the church "sits in Moses' seat", then regardless of its institutional flaws and the failings of individuals within its ranks, you observe the laws not because of who your leaders are but because of who you are.

Jesus also taught the multitudes that "except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven."

So, if you're coming from a Christian paradigm, believing that these words in Matthew are a reliable account of the teachings of the Son of God, and you also believe there is a rightful line of priesthood authority (not power, that is an individual matter, just authority) then I think you remain observant but with the intellectual and emotional understanding that the church is a vehicle for assisting in what is largely a very personal journey. Your relationship with the church stops being "What can I get out of this?" and becomes "How can I help others get the most out of this?" which paradoxically propels you further along the Way.

This is a wonderful post. Thank you for sharing that.

[_consiglieri]

It's from Emerson's essay Self-Reliance.

If it rings to you, you won't regret reading the whole thing in context.

Thanks a lot!

I have printed it off and look forward to perusing it at length later this evening.

All the Best!

--Consiglieri