article by R. Packham

[_Darth J]

And anyway, what would be the practical effect if Mormons somehow subverted the U.S. government and installed Thomas S. Monson as a theocratic dictator? Then what? We'll all be subjected to a choice Thanksgiving program and a piece of pie?

If this is the diabolical mastermind who is capable of taking over the United States, then we deserve to be taken over.

[_marg]

And anyway, what would be the practical effect if Mormons somehow subverted the U.S. government and installed Thomas S. Monson as a theocratic dictator? Then what? We'll all be subjected to a choice Thanksgiving program and a piece of pie?

In all my time observing Mormons on the Net..that's about 12 years from the beginning... what stood out for me, is that Mormons are fundamentally dishonest people. I realize Mormons such as Kish would take that as an offense. The first Mormon I ever knew, lied though he/she wouldn't necessarily have noticed it themselves. It was just part of their make-up and I'm sure they weren't aware of it but they looked upon themselves as extremely moral.. pretty much anyone else especially not Mormon. So dishonesty seems to me to be part of the Mormon culture...and perhaps that stems from the founders. Whether or not that would have negative consequences if someone from that culture is in power..I don't know. But we did see polygamy instituted by Mormons and they lied about their practice of it. And the only reason it was stopped was because of legal pressure. So I'm not sure what all the practical negative consequences might be...but I do think a faithful TBM type Mormon in power would consider first and foremost their allegiance to the church and what it wants, over and above all else.

[_angsty]

I find it disconcerting in the same way that I find it disconcerting when I hear people praise the faith and obedience of Abraham after discussing his willingness to sacrifice his son because God had commanded it. It's difficult for me to understand how people, parents especially, can consider it admirable to have that kind of faith and certainty. In reality, we send those kinds of people (the Abraham kind) to the booby hatch and take their children away. That people can, within the context of a gospel discussion, find a way to admire that kind of faith and willingness to obey and strive to achieve it, completely creeps me out. But, at the same time, I think most mentally-sound individuals, even believers who admire Abraham's faith and obedience, would not have the ability to act on any such direction.

So with the relationship between temple covenants and the office of the President of the US. I think it is, in principle, a problematic issue. I would be worried if certain members of my extended family, or last ward were to run for office. I believe they really would see it as a divinely-appointed opportunity to serve the Lord's interests (as they see it), and they would feel very righteous about making it a priority. However, Romney's apparent lack of principle puts my mind at ease on this front.

Of course, he could be a covert Danite pretending to be without integrity for the sole purpose of getting elected and then using his presidential influence to forward the building of Zion and whatever else is on the church's agenda.

[_Cicero]

In all my time observing Mormons on the Net..that's about 12 years from the beginning... what stood out for me, is that Mormons are fundamentally dishonest people.

Well, I won't speak for Kish, but that certainly insults me and 6 generations of my ancestors. I have no idea what Romney believes in other than himself (if he has demonstrated anything in the last 10 years it is the ability to be very flexible in his policies).

[_Kishkumen]

In all my time observing Mormons on the Net..that's about 12 years from the beginning... what stood out for me, is that Mormons are fundamentally dishonest people.

Well, I won't speak for Kish, but that certainly insults me and 6 generations of my ancestors. I have no idea what Romney believes in other than himself (if he has demonstrated anything in the last 10 years it is the ability to be very flexible in his policies).

Yup. Bigotry ain't pretty.

[_Darth J]

...but I do think a faithful TBM type Mormon in power would consider first and foremost their allegiance to the church and what it wants, over and above all else.

Holy God, marg, you're talking about an organization that obsesses about rated R movies and how many earrings girls can have, and you've got your panties in a bunch thinking this milquetoast church with some funny tall tales is a sinister cabal of Illuminati that's going to take over the world.

[_marg]

Yup. Bigotry ain't pretty.

Remember that time you accused me of saying someone I hadn't and even when I linked to the post to show you I hadn't you wouldn't acknowledge? I consider that dishonesty.

[_Kishkumen]

Remember that time you accused me of saying someone I hadn't and even when I linked to the post to show you I hadn't you wouldn't acknowledge? I consider that dishonesty.

So you are now going to prove that all Mormons are dishonest, starting with me, to defend your bigotry against Mormons?

That's rich. Good luck, marg. Have fun proving that all Mormons are dishonest.

[_marg]

Holy God, marg, you're talking about an organization that obsesses about rated R movies and how many earrings girls can have, and you've got your panties in a bunch thinking this milquetoast church with some funny tall tales is a sinister cabal of Illuminati that's going to take over the world.

I think the biggest threat to mankind..is mankind itself which will likely cause its own self destruction and not necessarily all that far off into the future. I do think the LDS church with its interest in amassing assets and not much if any interest in people's well being...will become problematic because they'll have too much economic power for people to keep them out of their lives.

[_marg]

So you are now going to prove that all Mormons are dishonest, starting with me, to defend your bigotry against Mormons?

That's rich. Good luck, marg. Have fun proving that all Mormons are dishonest.

I don't have to do anything Kish. I'm telling you what my observations are over 12 years on the net, reading what Mormons write and how they behave. That is my over-all impression. How you internalize that ...is up to you.

Of course I don't think every Mormon is dishonest, or that Mormons are dishonest about every single thing, but I think the culture encourages and accepts dishonesty ..and that many individuals are not necessarily aware of it. That's one of the reasons for example DCP has no problem taking Obama's words out of context..because honesty is not what is important to him. He may not even be aware of this...he's just so used to dishonesty he may not even notice.