Another Sad Day in Sunday School

[_zeezrom]

I think the main dilemma Mormons get into when they really want to learn more is that they are put into this vicious circle (as opposed to a viscous circle, Droopy), where they want to learn more, but are told there is nothing more to learn.

They keep reading the scriptures while simultaneously reading into the scriptures contemporary Mormonism, with the result they are ever learning and never able to come to a knowledge of the truth.

Perhaps this thread would be more valuable if we discussed how this hurdle can be surmounted. In other words, how do you take somebody who is unconsciously reading one particular preconceived view into the scriptures and help them see there is a world of meaning beyond that myopic understanding?

All the Best!

--Consiglieri

This can be done if you first kill Smaug the dragon (Correlation). It is possible. Start by commanding all the zealots to start their own sect (Boyd K Packer will lead them).

[_zeezrom]

You've seen how vacuous and empty the church's lessons are. You have complained about them for years on this board. If the church sucks this bad, what is still drawing you to it, like a moth to the flame? If it's really true then maybe you're doing it wrong and should show the church a lot more respect, and if it's not really true, then why are you still playing the game at all?

Being an NOM, Mormon 2.0 follower, Brooks follower, etc, can be very draining on a person.

[_Infymus]

I think the main dilemma Mormons get into when they really want to learn more is that they are put into this vicious circle (as opposed to a viscous circle, Droopy), where they want to learn more, but are told there is nothing more to learn.

They keep reading the scriptures while simultaneously reading into the scriptures contemporary Mormonism, with the result they are ever learning and never able to come to a knowledge of the truth.

This is exactly what happened to me. Hell, I read the Book of Mormon 17 times. I thirsted at a supposed over flowing well of knowledge. I was told to stop thinking, stop reading, stop trying to understand. I was given the old "shelve your questions" and just pay and obey. All answers would be given once I died.

It wasn't until I allowed myself to read "Anti-Mormon" literature did I finally get my fill.

[_Cicero]

This is exactly what happened to me. Hell, I read the Book of Mormon 17 times. I thirsted at a supposed over flowing well of knowledge. I was told to stop thinking, stop reading, stop trying to understand. I was given the old "shelve your questions" and just pay and obey. All answers would be given once I died.

It wasn't until I allowed myself to read "Anti-Mormon" literature did I finally get my fill.

Yes, and thus we see that there is a reason why members are discouraged from thinking too much about the "mysteries." If Church leadership is so determined to make our weekly meetings so endlessly repetitive and banal (or, in their words, focused on the "Gospel Essentials") then why do we need to meet for 3 hours?

[_consiglieri]

Yes, and thus we see that there is a reason why members are discouraged from thinking too much about the "mysteries." If Church leadership is so determined to make our weekly meetings so endlessly repetitive and banal (or, in their words, focused on the "Gospel Essentials") then why do we need to meet for 3 hours?

The reason for this is quite simple, actually.

The general church membership is so evil we need to keep hearing the same things over and over again, with the celestial carrot continually held out that when we start doing the things we are supposed to do, then we will be ready to learn the mysteries.

Of course, this promise is one that need never be fulfilled as there will always be members not doing everything they are supposed to.

In fact, there may be no members in that august category.

All the Best!

--Consiglieri

[_Yoda]

This is exactly what happened to me. Hell, I read the Book of Mormon 17 times. I thirsted at a supposed over flowing well of knowledge. I was told to stop thinking, stop reading, stop trying to understand. I was given the old "shelve your questions" and just pay and obey. All answers would be given once I died.

It wasn't until I allowed myself to read "Anti-Mormon" literature did I finally get my fill.

Yes, and thus we see that there is a reason why members are discouraged from thinking too much about the "mysteries." If Church leadership is so determined to make our weekly meetings so endlessly repetitive and banal (or, in their words, focused on the "Gospel Essentials") then why do we need to meet for 3 hours?

AMEN! If we are evolving into just another Presbyterian sect, then let's act like one, and have Sacrament Meeting and go home for the rest of the day. I think the Catholics have the right idea. They can go to Mass on either Saturday or Sunday. It is an hour long service, and they are good for the week.

[_consiglieri]

I don't want to be too confrontational about this, but it sounds a little rude for you to sit in the back of someone's class and read your own book instead of paying attention to the teacher. I have an idea. If you don't like what the teacher has to say then do what many of us have done and stop going. Sitting in the back contemptuously not paying attention is a little passive-aggressive, don't you think? Don't you think the teacher knows you're doing it, and is reading your message loud and clear that you think you're a lot smarter than she is? Isn't it a little rude to do that?

You've seen how vacuous and empty the church's lessons are. You have complained about them for years on this board. If the church sucks this bad, what is still drawing you to it, like a moth to the flame? If it's really true then maybe you're doing it wrong and should show the church a lot more respect, and if it's not really true, then why are you still playing the game at all?

You never need to worry about being rude with me, Sethbag. I always appreciate your insights and your comments, and here you raise a valid issue.

I have vacillated between going to Sunday school and reading something else and going out into the foyer or parking lot to read something else.

The one thing I cannot stomach doing anymore is sitting in Sunday school and actually paying attention.

So I do not know whether it is ruder to sit there and read or to absent myself from class and read. I try to not be too obvious about it, sitting toward the back and keeping my book below pew level so as to avoid observation.

The reason I am anywhere near the building during meeting time on Sundays has to do with my family more than anything else. Now that my wife is not teaching Primary anymore, I sit with her during Sunday school as well as sacrament meeting.

She feels it important to go to church for our sixteen year old daughter's sake. That is the main reason I am still there.

All the Best!

--Consiglieri

[_zeezrom]

AMEN! If we are evolving into just another Presbyterian sect, then let's act like one, and have Sacrament Meeting and go home for the rest of the day. I think the Catholics have the right idea. They can go to Mass on either Saturday or Sunday. It is an hour long service, and they are good for the week.

Too bad you can't just start taking your family to mass.

[_consiglieri]

This is exactly what happened to me. Hell, I read the Book of Mormon 17 times. I thirsted at a supposed over flowing well of knowledge. I was told to stop thinking, stop reading, stop trying to understand. I was given the old "shelve your questions" and just pay and obey. All answers would be given once I died.

It wasn't until I allowed myself to read "Anti-Mormon" literature did I finally get my fill.

I followed a similar path, Infymus.

I remember during the 1980's reading book after book on LDS Doctrine, struggling to learn things and finding myself blocked at virtually every turn.

I learned early to not expect anything from GA books and so avoided them.

What I ended up doing was reading the same things over and over again. I valued books by Joseph Fielding McConkie because he was capable of fresh insights here and there, though they were imbedded in books containing the same old thing. But the drudgery was worth it to me to find the nuggets.

Toward the end of the 1980's, I began to do an indepth study of the Adam-God Theory, and ended up writing a manuscript suggesting an alternative way to harmonize Brigham Young's teachings with those of the modern church.

Along the way, however, I had to come to grips with the fact that Brigham Young taught a number of concepts at variance with today's teachings. Making it more interesting was the modern church's repeated disavowals of the Adam-God Theory, together with denials Brigham Young had ever taught such a thing.

My studies told me differently.

Through this, I began to see that Brigham Young spoke clearly and repeatedly on the subject. If I took his words at face value, he was clear and consistent. On the other hand, I saw others twist his words away from their meaning in order to try to make him conform to current teachings.

By seeing this done with Brigham Young, I began to see it done in a host of different areas, up to and including the scriptures.

I began to see the value lay in trying to understand what the scriptures were saying, not in trying to make the scriptures conform with orthodox Mormonism.

And that has made all the difference.

All the Best!

--Consiglieri

[_consiglieri]

Too bad you can't just start taking your family to mass.

You could go with Why Me.