The Power of Disconfirming Evidence.

[drumdude]

Morley and drumdude, remember playing hopscotch when you were a kid?

You’re both doing it.

Regards,
MG

I think Morley has a good point.

[Res Ipsa]

Well said. I personally think that those of us who have been through a faith crisis, and realized that our deeply held beliefs turned out to be false, are much better prepared to deal with the world than those who only learn how to rationalize.

I think we've been given a gift, the ability to grow and reflect and leave no belief unchallenged and unexamined.

While that may be true in theory, I’m skeptical that it works out that way in practice.

[Gadianton]

So what I hear you saying is that anyone who goes through a faith crisis and comes out the other end believing that the truth claims for the LDS Church may have a basis in truth comes to that point through mistaken/error ridden rationalization?

Are kidnapping victims better off for continuing to take opportunities for escape or is it better to stay and make the best of it -- to "follow the kidnapper" so to speak?

[drumdude]

Well said. I personally think that those of us who have been through a faith crisis, and realized that our deeply held beliefs turned out to be false, are much better prepared to deal with the world than those who only learn how to rationalize.

I think we've been given a gift, the ability to grow and reflect and leave no belief unchallenged and unexamined.

While that may be true in theory, I’m skeptical that it works out that way in practice.

You think in practice dogmatic religious people who go through a faith crisis become dogmatic atheists?

[Res Ipsa]

While that may be true in theory, I’m skeptical that it works out that way in practice.

You think in practice dogmatic religious people who go through a faith crisis become dogmatic atheists?

No. I’m saying that my own interaction with former Mormons over the years has not persuaded me that the process of going through a faith crisis makes them any better at accepting evidence that contradicts whatever worldview they adopt after Mormonism.

I concluded some time ago that leaving Mormonism does not include a free coupon for a personality transplant. Changing religious beliefs does not automatically change who we are as people.

I agree with the “gift” analogy, in that a faith crisis creates an opportunity to change who we are. Much of our day to day life is performed on auto-pilot — things we do and choices we make without having to consider our deepest assumptions about who we are. The shock of realizing how wrong we were about Mormonism creates an opportunity for deep reevaluation and change, but it’s not clear to me how many take advantage of that opportunity. So, the gift is opportunity. Making use of that opportunity is a completely different story.

in my opinion, claiming that those that have left the church have a superior ability in terms of recognizing and rejecting false beliefs reflects a degree of hubris inconsistent with an actual change following a faith crisis. Those of who were believing Mormons who later concluded that Mormonism was false should be humbled by the fact that we were fooled about beliefs that were central to our sense of self. The important lesson is that we can be fooled about extremely important things. That should be a source of humility, not a source of pride.

[Bret Ripley]

The important lesson is that we can be fooled about extremely important things. That should be a source of humility, not a source of pride.

Selah.

[Dr. Shades]

The important lesson is that we can be fooled about extremely important things. That should be a source of humility, not a source of pride.

Selah.

???

[canpakes]

Selah.

???

Check this out:

https://www.crosswalk.com/faith/Bible-s ... -mean.html

[MG 2.0]

You think in practice dogmatic religious people who go through a faith crisis become dogmatic atheists?

No. I’m saying that my own interaction with former Mormons over the years has not persuaded me that the process of going through a faith crisis makes them any better at accepting evidence that contradicts whatever worldview they adopt after Mormonism.

I concluded some time ago that leaving Mormonism does not include a free coupon for a personality transplant. Changing religious beliefs does not automatically change who we are as people.

I agree with the “gift” analogy, in that a faith crisis creates an opportunity to change who we are. Much of our day to day life is performed on auto-pilot — things we do and choices we make without having to consider our deepest assumptions about who we are. The shock of realizing how wrong we were about Mormonism creates an opportunity for deep reevaluation and change, but it’s not clear to me how many take advantage of that opportunity. So, the gift is opportunity. Making use of that opportunity is a completely different story.

in my opinion, claiming that those that have left the church have a superior ability in terms of recognizing and rejecting false beliefs reflects a degree of hubris inconsistent with an actual change following a faith crisis. Those of who were believing Mormons who later concluded that Mormonism was false should be humbled by the fact that we were fooled about beliefs that were central to our sense of self. The important lesson is that we can be fooled about extremely important things. That should be a source of humility, not a source of pride.

Humans are humans. Good post, Rep Ipsa.

Regards,
MG

[MG 2.0]

Doesn't the CoJCoLDS teach that members have access to specific gifts that are not available to non-members? How is that any less arrogant than nonbelievers claiming gifts?

Where I would take issue is the seemingly ‘unwritten order of things’ that some critics seem to believe, that is, that by their very nature of having ‘been through the weeds’, so to speak, and found the truth of ‘non belief’ that they then are somehow superior in their thinking/reasoning abilities to those that find it reasonable to stay in the church.

Sure, believing members of the church do have access to the Holy Ghost as they are true to their covenants. But I don’t see that as falling within the realm of arrogance (being better than).

Intellectual arrogance, in my opinion, belongs in its own category of vanity…and ignorance. I think that in a certain sense it can cause spiritual blindness.

Regards,
MG