Re: New Project Shows Church Finance Corruption
Posted: Sat Oct 29, 2022 3:14 pm
Internet Mormons, Chapel Mormons, Critics, Apologists, and Never-Mo's all welcome!
https://discussmormonism.com/
“Google it?” LOLBeNotDeceived wrote: ↑Sat Oct 29, 2022 4:36 amDr., Google it... the average U.S. corporation invests, on average, around 10% of their net worth in the markets.
Damn, the wait for Zion, Florida continues without an end I sight.
Dr Moore wrote: ↑Sat Oct 29, 2022 3:42 pm“Google it?” LOLBeNotDeceived wrote: ↑Sat Oct 29, 2022 4:36 amDr., Google it... the average U.S. corporation invests, on average, around 10% of their net worth in the markets.
I’m sorry, but that sounds ridiculously uninformed and naïve. I have consulted with and invested in companies large and small, public and private for 20 years. My job requires me to examine financial statements in depth, and then assist CFOs in making better monetary decisions. Your 10% rule isn’t a thing. The wording of your statement betrays thin understanding. We don’t need to “test” it because your theory is nonsensical.
The information was from a Wall Street Journal article on investments in the markets from a few years ago. Go ahead and call it nonsensical if you want, they aren't educated guesses, theories or estimates, the data is straight from the WSJ and I hardly think the information is worth going off on someone over.
Companies sometimes invest some of their cash reserves in the markets, to safely improve returns on cash, but that is a risk decision that comes after strategic financial review of the business outlook, cash flow and capital reserves. Importantly, “net worth” (more properly, “total equity”) in a corporate sense is total assets minus liabilities, which is very different from “net cash,” which is total cash minus total debt. For the church, net cash is the $150+ billion, whereas net assets is by some accounts north of $250 billion (some think even more). When you say “net worth” and then refer to the church’s $150 billion, right away it’s obvious you don’t know what you are talking about. You’re confusing terms and numbers before even getting started with “analysis.”
Once again, the 'net worth' figure came from the Wall Street Journal article. I know what the difference is in these terms Dr., take up issue with the WSJ and tell them they don't know what they're talking about.
By the way, many large companies have a large “net worth” but zero or negative net cash. That will be true for high quality businesses with little or no existential threat. The leverage helps juice returns for equity holders. These companies generally have only minuscule amounts of money invested in the markets - because the cash is better deployed in the business or else aggressively returned to shareholders.
Very aware of this, assets - liabilities = OE and revenue - expenses = net income. Your net worth can be huge with zero or negative cash flow, correct.
The latter is what the church SHOULD be doing — returning unused cash to Jesus’ primary “shareholders” eg the poor. That is doesn’t is a travesty and a sad moral failure. The brethren are still trapped in a limited mentality of us vs the world. Weak.
Amen.
As to the Florida mega city plan, funny how people can make up big numbers to fit conspiracy narratives. Good luck selling this one to anybody. I assure you, all of my friends at Ensign Peak would have a good chuckle at the water cooler over that one.
'Conspiracy? Nice, save it. Would you like me to post the link showing how much it costs per resident to create a new city and then do the math and comparison/contrast to the $124 billion in that EPA account? It's quite simple and no conspiracy.
They gonna need piles of cash for this, all from instruction on high from Jesus himself...Dr Exiled wrote: ↑Sun Oct 30, 2022 10:09 pmJust watched the 60 Minutes Australia piece. My take is that corporations should be allowed to aggressively look for tax deductions within the law. If they, as a corporation, can shave a little off of their tax bill, then good for them. However, is this a church or a real estate/investment vehicle? If it is a church, as the piece pointed out, it should be involved in charitable purposes and not in wealth accumulation. The goal to reach $1 Trillion isn't a righteous one if that is their goal (and it looks like that is what they want to do, and beyond that).
Ah yes, so now you clarify the 10% rule isn't from "Google" but actually from a real authority: a mysterious "WSJ article." Good one. No link? Shame.BeNotDeceived wrote: ↑Tue Nov 01, 2022 12:04 amThe information was from a Wall Street Journal article on investments in the markets from a few years ago. Go ahead and call it nonsensical if you want, they aren't educated guesses, theories or estimates...
Again with the pivot to appeal to authority, without a link. Lame.BeNotDeceived wrote: ↑Tue Nov 01, 2022 12:04 amOnce again, the 'net worth' figure came from the Wall Street Journal article. I know what the difference is in these terms Dr., take up issue with the WSJ and tell them they don't know what they're talking about.
No need, I understand the numbers just fine. Here's a website I think you may enjoy: https://www.tylervigen.com/spurious-correlationsBeNotDeceived wrote: ↑Tue Nov 01, 2022 12:04 am'Conspiracy? Nice, save it. Would you like me to post the link showing how much it costs per resident to create a new city and then do the math and comparison/contrast to the $124 billion in that EPA account? It's quite simple and no conspiracy.
“Are you honest in your dealings with your fellow men?”Dr Moore wrote: ↑Sun Oct 30, 2022 3:56 pmThe hits keep coming. Today, 60 minutes released the long presentation of “Cooking the Book of Mormon” (“book” as a play on the financial books, cooked to help members dodge taxes in Australia)
https://youtu.be/pFddArTfjhQ
Yikes.
Yep!“Are you honest in your dealings with your fellow men?”
I can see why the Morms got rid of that question.
- Doc