Kids who die before age 8 DON'T automatically go to the C.K.

[_ludwigm]

Deuteronomy 7:6 For thou art an holy people unto the LORD thy God: the LORD thy God hath chosen thee to be a special people unto himself, above all people that are upon the face of the earth.

You wrote this in answer to the statement about God not being a respecter of persons. And I have to agree that on its face it appears that this is a major conflict with other passages.

It not appears, it is.

So when a statement like "God hath chosen thee to be a special people unto himself" just what does this mean. To me God has chosen every single place for all spirits to live in the flesh. So in this case the Jews are not unique.

And god has chosen the place for the Hittites, and the Girgashites, and the Amorites, and the Canaanites, and the Perizzites, and the Hivites, and the Jebusites - for example.

1. When the LORD thy God shall bring thee into the land whither thou goest to possess it, and hath cast out many nations before thee, the Hittites, and the Girgashites, and the Amorites, and the Canaanites, and the Perizzites, and the Hivites, and the Jebusites, seven nations greater and mightier than thou;
2. And when the LORD thy God shall deliver them before thee; thou shalt smite them, and utterly destroy them; thou shalt make no covenant with them, nor shew mercy unto them:
3. Neither shalt thou make marriages with them; thy daughter thou shalt not give unto his son, nor his daughter shalt thou take unto thy son.

They may be unique in the way He has chosen to deal with them on earth. He instructed Moses to declare the law and to hold the feet of the Jews to a fire to uphold that standard. The Law of Moses is not a fun set of instructions.

Yes. The law: "thou shalt smite them, and utterly destroy them" not a fun.

But they also received the two greatest commandments. You shall love your God and love each other.

But thus shall ye deal with them; ye shall destroy their altars, and break down their images, and cut down their groves, and burn their graven images with fire. (Deut 7:5)

Love each other, ehh...

If one looks for error in scripture you will find it.

Especially if the scripture is full of this type errors.

I could have written volumes on this

Thank You that You did not do it.

Apparently You didn't followed the law: "nor shew mercy unto them"...

[_jo1952]

God is NOT a respecter of persons!

And you said this with a straight face.

Hello Harmony,

Yes, I actually did say that with a straight face. It is man, in his imperfectness, who is a respecter of persons. It is also in his imperfectness (lacking of all Truth), that man will not be able to see that God is not a respecter of persons.

Blessings,

jo

[_jo1952]

Through the Atonement of Jesus Christ, all children who die before arriving at the years of accountability will inherit celestial glory.

Seems a clear answer to me...

Hi Drifting,

However, you are only looking at a "part" of All Truth. As Paul taught:

1 Corinthians 13:12 (KJV)

12 For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known.

Once we have all of the "parts", In other words, know ALL Truth, we will be able to see through a glass clearly - we will have become completely enlightened. Another HUGE mystery is being taught by Paul in the last part of that passage; but it is not necessary to discuss that right now.

This is how it is for all of scripture. We cannot even begin to make complete interpretations of what we are reading until we have received all of the parts of Truth which make up "All Truth". This is why there are so many different interpretations of the very same passage; because people have had different parts of Truth revealed to them. As long as we have incomplete information, we cannot interpret what we read correctly. This is why we need the help and guidance of the Holy Spirit. There is sooooo much knowledge and Truth which is available. But we must prepare ourselves to be ready to receive it.

Paul also taught us to share what has been revealed to us for the edification and benefit of the members of the church. Our own spirit becomes a conduit for receiving Truth. As we build upon the Truth (receive more parts) we have learned, precept upon precept, we actually reach a point of what I like to describe as critical mass. Suddenly, we are capable of having knowledge and Truth poured into our spirit in a continual flowing of Truth. Suddenly, we will not be able to read one single passage without seeing so much more. It can take hours to get through one chapter. During the entire process....from milk learning where we are only receiving temporal Truth, through the progression to meat learning where we begin to receive spiritual Truth, our ability to understand Scripture advances. That is when we are able to start seeing the layers and layers of understanding. Thus, the further we progress toward receiving All Truth, the more layers are opened up to us. We begin to see the deep meanings which God has "hidden" in scripture. As our blindness is removed, these meanings are no longer hidden from us. (Praise God!!!)

Blessings, my friend!

jo

[_jo1952]

We are here to learn - and we learn from making mistakes; and we learn from doing what is right. Our Leaders are here for the same reason.

Blessings,

jo

Actually, the Church teaches that you are to follow the Prophets counsel even if you think he is making a mistake.

Hi Drifting!

CFR please, before I share any comments.

Thanks,

jo

[_Yoda]

I guess it's okay to believe that I don't need to pay tithing as long as I keep paying it. No problem there. Unfortunately for me, I actually acted on my belief and stopped paying, which meant I didn't get to ordain my son to the priesthood and probably won't get to baptize another child in a few months.

This is horrible! I honestly don't know if this is standard, or if this is a choice your bishop has made. Maybe someone with access to a current Handbook of Instructions can help us out?

[_Stormy Waters]

We are here to learn - and we learn from making mistakes; and we learn from doing what is right. Our Leaders are here for the same reason.

Blessings,

jo

Actually, the Church teaches that you are to follow the Prophets counsel even if you think he is making a mistake.

Hi Drifting!

CFR please, before I share any comments.

Thanks,

jo

“My boy, you always keep your eye on the President of the Church, and if he tells you to do something wrong, and you do it, the Lord will bless you for it."
http://www.LDS.org/ensign/1972/07/the-covenant-of-the-priesthood?lang=eng

[_jo1952]

Hi Jo,

I too believe in multiple lives (or phases) that we experience. Our mortal experience is but one of many that we have experienced and will yet experience.

You also hit on the concept of reincarnation. I also believe in this, but more along the lines of how the Lord talks about it. In the case of children being raised during the Millenium and being given the opportunities that we have. Reincarnation is certainly a requirement. But not in the traditional sense that most people think about it. If the Lord was able to bring Lazarus back to life, he certainly could restore a dead child so that they could learn and grow during the Millenium. And I believe this is what the prophets are talking about when they speak about this.

Hello Tobin!

I am so happy that you are not backing down in your stance, despite the many antagonistic comments being made.

I thought it would be appropriate at this point to offer to both posters and readers to take a look at comments I have already written about this subject on another thread.

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=24651

As you can see, I think there is much more to reincarnation than only providing a way for those who die before the age of accountability (or for those who are unable to make choices). Multiple probations allow us to become perfect just as Jesus commanded. Franktalk will be adding some of his thoughts on this later today. I look forward to seeing how they are received.

Blessings,

jo

[_Tchild]

Hi Jo,

I too believe in multiple lives (or phases) that we experience. Our mortal experience is but one of many that we have experienced and will yet experience.

You also hit on the concept of reincarnation. I also believe in this, but more along the lines of how the Lord talks about it. In the case of children being raised during the Millenium and being given the opportunities that we have. Reincarnation is certainly a requirement. But not in the traditional sense that most people think about it. If the Lord was able to bring Lazarus back to life, he certainly could restore a dead child so that they could learn and grow during the Millenium. And I believe this is what the prophets are talking about when they speak about this.

Hello Tobin!

I am so happy that you are not backing down in your stance, despite the many antagonistic comments being made.

I thought it would be appropriate at this point to offer to both posters and readers to take a look at comments I have already written about this subject on another thread.

http://mormondiscussions.com/phpBB3/vie ... =3&t=24651

As you can see, I think there is much more to reincarnation than only providing a way for those who die before the age of accountability (or for those who are unable to make choices). Multiple probations allow us to become perfect just as Jesus commanded. Franktalk will be adding some of his thoughts on this later today. I look forward to seeing how they are received.

Blessings,

jo

You two are just like all the ex-mos here: you believe something other than what Mormonism teaches and believes.

Welcome!

[_Tobin]

You two are just like all the ex-mos here: you believe something other than what Mormonism teaches and believes.

Welcome!

I don't believe that is accurate. Where Jo and I (and others) are coming from is a more evolved understanding of Mormonism. It isn't something other than Mormonism, but a richer view of Mormonism and what it hints at. For example, Joseph Smith often spoke of things he could not reveal and this topic and others are part of that larger discussion.

[_Themis]

You two are just like all the ex-mos here: you believe something other than what Mormonism teaches and believes.

Welcome!

I don't believe that is accurate. Where Jo and I (and others) are coming from is a more evolved understanding of Mormonism. It isn't something other than Mormonism, but a richer view of Mormonism and what it hints at. For example, Joseph Smith often spoke of things he could not reveal and this topic and others are part of that larger discussion.

Of course you have your own version of what you think true Mormonism looks like. So does Jo whose will look a little different then yours. The point is that Mormonism that Joseph came up with and the church teaches today about children who die before 8 is different then yours. You think Joseph and the church today is wrong. That's fine by me.