William Schryver - The Vulgar Scatologist of LDS Apologetics

[_beastie]

Who else talks like this? Jesus? I'm asking seriously here.

A vain amateur actor who always imagines himself on stage. Seriously.

[Guest]

I'm sure she wishes you had learned more from her and less from the world that has been your preferred and primary tutor.

My mother is actually quite proud of all her children. You see, my mothers cares more for how I live my life than for what I believe. She would rather have a son who tries to emulate the life of Jesus than one who resorts to crude and offensive language and tactics in "defense of the faith."

Again, you have lost all touch will reality and are an embarrassment to Mormonism.

In any case, your rhetorical gnashing of teeth is typical of those to whom I represent "the foe." It's almost as though you all read from the same script. You and your friends here are in complete accord on all the points you reference above. I am not surprised, for I know you well, as I know your friends. As I also know myself, and my friends. We are all being gathered into the camps we prefer.

Yes, Will, my profession of a belief in God and a call to emulate the life of Jesus is certainly a "gnashing of teeth." Your references to circle jerks, whores, and racial slurs are *exactly* what the Gospel of Jesus Christ are all about. How could I have been so misled for so long?

I also know very well why some people are so viscerally offended by me and my words, just as you are now--and it is not to your credit that you have yielded yourself to the spirit that stirs you up to anger against me.

I'm not offended by you, Will. I'm offended by your crudeness, your sexist remarks, your willingness to mock those with whom you disagree etc....

As I've said many many many times: You are an incredibly intelligent man who has a lot to offer the world of Mormon apologetics -- especially in regard to the Book of Abraham. Unfortunately, your crass and nasty exterior too often distract from the intellect that lies beneath.

Nevertheless, I will not attempt further to "open your eyes," for I know you will not. At least not now. Your feet are set on the course you have chosen for yourself. Your self-delusion is willful and your rationalizations relentless. You claim to have faith in god, but it is a god of your own creation, whose substance is that of an idol. And both it and you will, absent a mighty change of heart, ultimately fall. I sincerely hope that somewhere along the way, before it is everlastingly too late, the scales of darkness will fall from your eyes, and you will cease to worship your idol god. But if not, it will not be for lack of warning.

Will, it is my hope that one day, when we get to the other side of this life, that you and I can sit down over a beer and laugh about the sheer stupidity of your comment above.

However, it is clear that we will not sway one another on this matter. You may consider me an enemy, but I consider you a friend and a brother in the Church. Granted, you are a friend that is acting like a complete douche at the moment but you are a friend and brother nonetheless.

I know that you will not find this interesting but I wrote a bit about the seeming human need for enemies here.

I am sincere when I say: God bless you.

[_Nimrod]

You claim to have faith in god, but it is a god of your own creation, ... .

Better a god of one's own creation than of the creation by any other man--including another man named Joseph Smith.

[_Analytics]

You may consider me an enemy, but I consider you a friend and a brother in the Church. Granted, you are a friend that is acting like a complete douche at the moment but you are a friend and brother nonetheless.

LOL. You are a good guy.

Has anybody compared the Jesus of the D&C with the Jesus of the New Testament? I can see Seth getting along with one and William getting along with the other.

[_Nimrod]

I also know very well why some people are so viscerally offended by me and my words, just as you are now--and it is not to your credit that you have yielded yourself to the spirit that stirs you up to anger against me.

Who else talks like this? Jesus? I'm asking seriously here.

Kind of sounds like that full-of-himself little brother, Nephi from the Book of Mormon. I think Will is practicing for the day he's the LDS prophet. When that happens, watch out. There will all of a sudden and after a string of spiritually deaf and mute prophets that received no revelation be a rash of revelations. And it will be the hell fire and damnation type of revelation. Might even get a dozen, hell maybe even a score, of new sections in the D&C during his reign.

[_Nimrod]

Has anybody compared the Jesus of the D&C with the Jesus of the New Testament?

Twin sons of different mothers.

Or perhaps, 1800 years of being resurrected makes one cranky.

[_sethpayne]

LOL. You are a good guy.

Thanks Analytics. Sometimes I'm a complete douche too. That's why it is so easy for me to spot one. :)

Has anybody compared the Jesus of the D&C with the Jesus of the New Testament? I can see Seth getting along with one and William getting along with the other.

Interesting question. The Jesus of the New Testament said forgive your enemies 7 x 70 times. The Jesus in the D&C says you should forgive up to 3 but on the fourth.... well, all hell breaks loose.

However, it should be noted that there are several beautiful and moving passages in the D&C. I just don't think Joseph could escape the rabid puritan New England theology of a vengeful God. It permeates all of his early work.

However, Joseph seems to have become more ecumenical during the Nauvoo period. When it was proposed that a brother be brought before the High Council for believing a false doctrine, Joseph's response was:

“Methodists have creeds which a man must believe or be asked out of their church. I want the liberty of thinking and believing as I please. It feels so good not to be trammeled [sic]. It does not prove that a man is not a good man because he errs in doctrine.”

- Joseph Smith (Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, p. 288)

[_Paul Osborne]

Trevor,

I just got out of outer darkness, being banned from the board for a few days, compliments of the good Dr. Shades.

I'm beginning to think you may be worrying about loosing the bet. Are you starting to get a little concerned? You should be. Our friend William is getting close to the breaking point. It won't take much more to break him. I can feel it. I see him in my mind's eye.

William, you will be an apostate of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. It is your destiny. A good destiny. You'll like it, trust me.

Paul O

[_Gadianton]

Hi Paul,

I too believe that Trevor should be making preparations to pay. In kind, at least as far as the domain of Church "metaphysics" goes, will and Seth are indeed brothers and if Seth is a full-blown apostate it is only a small degree that separates Will from Seth. Will also doubts the "metaphysics" of the church, just read what he's had to say on the Book of Abraham and Book of Mormon. Sethpayne has only been expressing a slightly more aggressive version of Internet Mormon principles we've been hearing over the years -- don't take everything so literally, concern yourselves with the metaphors and narrative and quit looking for "proof". Will's very own project which is steadfast in the current "Moby Dick" tradition of apologetics is designed to take the Book of Abraham debate closer to Sethpayne's world than any Chapel Mormon perspective.

In fact, if you haven't already set the terms on what constitutes "apostasy", if one's apostasy doesn't have to be self-described, then I think Trevor owes you 100 bucks right now because Will is already an apostate based on his Internet Mormon beliefs. Don't take it from me, take Schryver's views on "translation" -- with his scare quotes and all -- and submit these views to the typical Chapel Mormon associated with FIRM. You know what you'll hear? You'll hear Will being criticized for all the same reasons Will is criticizing Seth. Only a small degree separates their worlds, in the domain of "metaphysics" that is. In fact, all Sethpayne would probably have to do is take a more supportive stance towards apologetics and without changing a single one of his "metaphysical" positions they'd probably be patting him on the back rather than criticizing him.

[_Paul Osborne]

August is coming soon as William nervously cuts his work out of Joseph Smith's book of lies. It's a lost cause. His friends will not support him like he thinks they will. They will be laughing at him and talk behind his back. He has become the newest fruitcake of Book of Abraham apologetics! It's the apologist with a ponytail - the hippie professor of FAIR. Move over Kerry Shirts. William is taking over.

I think we should all gather around in a circle and sing songs about William Schryver and make fun of him. It will take us back to the 5th grade when life was so simple. Isn't that right, William?

I will gladly mail Trevor's $100 to William just as soon as William denies the Book of Abraham and gets on board with the winning team.

Paul O