It's Official - Stand and Shout the Gays are Out (link)

[_Droopy]

I don't think any serious person doubts that you're a closeted, self-loathing homosexual.

On whats grounds?

On the grounds that you're obviously attracted to men, and obviously hate that about yourself.

On what grounds?

[_subgenius]

Sure, because murdering teenagers and drinking beer and watching porn and being a homosexual are all the same in the end. Tell me more.

now your posting like an idiot.
Substitute any "is not sanctioned by or is condemned by the church" activity.

How can you possibly be missing the actual point?

Do you like shiny stuff?

[_Droopy]

Take another look at this, John. This is pseudoscience, at best.

Support your assertion with facts. Point to legitimate studies that overturn Runtu's sources.

I supported my assertions with a body of logical argument and criticism of its methodology, assumptions, and inferential strength.

Put up, Bluff, or shut up.

[_subgenius]

Wow. A five year-old Washington State Supreme Court split decision. That's your best shot?

...

just one of many shots in this here pistol....but i thought i would start easy...and glad i did, because you obviously understand little about court decisions and law.
But hey, like i told Buffalot...you must really have disdain for Roe v Wade, cause that was like decades ago

and it wasn't a split decision there, math wiz...

[_Droopy]

And what defense of your self-loathing homophobia have you ever made that didn't rely on ipse dixit and ad hominems?

Since I've never made any defense of characteristics of mine that do not exist, the answer here is: never.

[_Runtu]

What has happened to your friend is the natural, inevitable consequence of living in opposition to, or out of harmony with, the nature of happiness. He is out of harmony with the laws of the universe (gospel), and, irrespective of whether all the actions of his wife (for whom I do not see the slightest empathy from you) or some members of the ward were perfectly righteous, the consequences of accepting his homosexuality as is and coming to see himself as "gay" (as opposed to being attracted to those of the same sex, and leaving it at that while he seeks the meaning and resolution to this mortal struggle) is what is and is going to be, so long as he continues on the assumption that he is Gay, at his very core, and draws no line and takes no stand against it within his own soul.

I don't have any interest in justifying what my friend has done because, frankly, I can't justify it. I think it's reprehensible for him to sneak around having furtive encounters, and I have told him that I think he should get out of a very unhappy marriage. And his drinking is very destructive, obviously.

What I do know is that he did draw a line and take a stand, and it led to the life he has had. To clarify, he didn't deceive anyone; his wife was aware of everything when they married. He was faithful to her until well after she told him she couldn't care less if he stayed or left, that he was of no consequence to her (this was when she sent him to the basement). So, no, I don't have a lot of empathy for someone who does that--and that had nothing to do with his sexuality.

And this is for subgenius: I told this story not as an argument but to explain why this issue matters to me. That you can't distinguish a personal anecdote from argument isn't my problem.

[_Droopy]

And now homosexuality is analogous to murder.

No. Keep in mind that the entire support of homosexual life and lifestyles (outside of postmodern philosophy, anyway), is that it is genetically determined. It is a genetic trait, like height, eye color, hair texture, and how one absorbs and utilizes certain vitamins and minerals. It is immutable and fixed.

This argument, as I have pointed out before, depending on the relative perception within the culture of the "yuck factor" of any particular behavior at any particular time, can be turned on its head by simply inserting what at present are still relatively "yucky" practices (such as pedophilia) into the "born that way" biological determinist argument and pointing out that, at one time, the present practice was once "yucky" but is now, after just a few decades of major value shifts within the culture, now non-yucky, and that there is no reason to think that, given continued shifting in values and ideology, the still yucky will not, at some future time, attain the same non-yucky status as homosexuality now enjoys.

Every sexual fetish and personality distortion, from homosexuality to pedophilia to BDSM to wife swapping could participate in the postmodern age, and probably will, given time. There is, after all, no inherent logical end or boundary to the extension of normativity to any conceivable self identity, desire, or predilection, once the gospel has been removed from consideration. All things, we should remember, are permitted in theory, once God is not thought to exist and the principles of his gospel are removed from consideration.

[_Droopy]

But hey, like i told Buffalot...


Now, this has potential. I've began with "Bluffalo," but now I see the potential for further refinement.

Behold the emergence of...


Sir Bluffalot.

Now this works for me...

[_Droopy]

But hey, like i told Buffalot...

Now, this has potential. I began with "Bluffalo," but now I see a possibility for further refinement.

Behold the emergence of...


Sir Bluffalot.

Now this works for me...

[_Morley]

Wow. A five year-old Washington State Supreme Court split decision. That's your best shot?

...

just one of many shots in this here pistol....but i thought i would start easy...and glad i did, because you obviously understand little about court decisions and law.
But hey, like i told Buffalot...you must really have disdain for Roe v Wade, cause that was like decades ago

and it wasn't a split decision there, math wiz...

My emphasis.

From the article:

In a 5-to-4 decision, the Washington Supreme Court upheld a state law banning same-sex marriages. The justices issued six opinions in the case, with some in the majority saying that the state legislature remained free to extend the right to marry to gay and lesbian couples.

A 5-to-4 decision is what's known as a split decision.