Church Surveillance

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_Coggins7
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Post by _Coggins7 »

That is sheer bluster born out of the fantasies of an ideologically addled brain.



It also has the happy attribute of being true.

Extensions of Power? Quinn's agenda. Origins of Power? more of Quinn's leftist PC intellectual stage managing using terms and phraseology drawn from Feminism and trendy ideological fads within the humanities and social sciences . Same Sex Dynamics? almost wholesale historical fabrication in the name of...correct Trevor, ideology. The Magic World View? Yup, a smarmy Intellectual and semantic denigration, given in the very title, of a religious community and its beliefs(there is, of course, no "magic world view" among LDS) by secular elitist intellectual with an ultimately personal agenda.

Quinn is, in the larger scheme of things intellectual and historical, an irrelevancy, and that, I suspect, is what really grates, because both Quinn and his shills need, really, really badly, for Quinn to matter.
Last edited by Dr. Sunstoned on Tue Apr 15, 2008 9:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.
The face of sin today often wears the mask of tolerance.


- Thomas S. Monson
_Trevor
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Post by _Trevor »

Coggins7 wrote:I have to say that observing Trevor having his backside handed back to him in this manner is most gratifying, especially given his smarmy, pseudo sophisticate intellectual pose on this board.


The only humiliation here is that I have to read your dribble about my backside.

Coggins7 wrote:So, we now know only that Trevor is hostile to economic liberty, America, and patriotic feeling toward it. We now no something more about Trevor, but little more about Benson. Hugh Nibley was well to the left of center in economic and some political areas, and Harry Reid is a full blown left wing statoloter. Romney plays the center in a kind of cocktail kind of way. The question is, what does any of this say about the Church (perhaps Reid should be left out of the discussion, because his leftism has taken him, in more ways then one, well beyond the bounds of Church doctrine and social teaching in several areas. Reid's politics cannot possibly be connected to anything he absorbed in the Church (or from the constitution) so maybe his case is rather moot)?

In one thing, Trevor is bound to be correct: the overwhelming population of active LDS are going to lean toward the conservative/libertarian field of political philosophy (I think, in all seriousness, calling Hugh B. Brown a "liberal Democrat" is a little of a stretch, as Brown was a part of the Depression era generation and part of a Democratic Party substantially different ideologically than the post sixties Democrat Party s it exists today. He was a Democrat, but...liberal? Well, yes, in another sense of the term, a much earlier Roosevelt, Kennedy, Humphrey sense. There's plenty to disagree with in that earlier liberalism, but its nothing approaching what it became after the McGovern candidacy) because these are the philosophies most harmonizable with Church doctrine and philosophy.


What we actually learn here is that Coggins, like crocket, is apparently unable to read. Well, I should give him more credit than that--he reads what he wants so he can launch into an irrelevant diatribe about modern liberalism.

Too bad for you that we already know your schtick and take it for what it is worth: zilch.
“I was hooked from the start,” Snoop Dogg said. “We talked about the purpose of life, played Mousetrap, and ate brownies. The kids thought it was off the hook, for real.”
_Coggins7
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Joined: Fri Nov 03, 2006 12:25 am

Post by _Coggins7 »

The only humiliation here is that I have to read your dribble about my backside.



OK, I should have just said your ass. That's a much more appropriate, good ol' red blooded American jingoistic term we right wingers like to use our here on the fruited plain.

You are so typical of your ilk.
The face of sin today often wears the mask of tolerance.


- Thomas S. Monson
_Trevor
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Post by _Trevor »

Coggins7 wrote:Extensions of Power? Quinn's agenda. Origins of Power? more of Quinn's leftist PC intellectual stage managing using terms and phraseology drawn from Feminism and trendy ideological fads within the humanities and social sciences . Same Sex Dynamics? almost wholesale historical fabrication in the name of...correct Trevor, ideology. The Magic World View? Yup, a smarmy Intellectual and semantic denigration, given in the very title, of a religious community and its beliefs(there is, of course, no "magic world view" among LDS) by secular elitist intellectual with an ultimately personal agenda.


Once again, Coggins seeks to reduce everything he reads to his simplistic, binary view of the universe. Replacing light and darkness, good and evil, and the other popular polar opposites of the past, is Coggins' "conservative and liberal", under which he has marshalled all other binary pair.

Furthermore, he is transparently trying to change the topic from his mind reading of Quinn to more of his political fiddle-faddle. Coggins pretends to know what motivated Quinn, drawing a conclusion that cuts against everything Quinn has ever said about his own motivations. Something tells me that Coggins is a crappy mindreader. Certainly this attempt has failed.
“I was hooked from the start,” Snoop Dogg said. “We talked about the purpose of life, played Mousetrap, and ate brownies. The kids thought it was off the hook, for real.”
_Trevor
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Post by _Trevor »

Coggins7 wrote:OK, I should have just said your ass. That's a much more appropriate, good ol' red blooded American jingoistic term we right wingers like to use our here on the fruited plain.

You are so typical of your ilk.


Boxing with shadows yet again, Coggins. How sad.
“I was hooked from the start,” Snoop Dogg said. “We talked about the purpose of life, played Mousetrap, and ate brownies. The kids thought it was off the hook, for real.”
_Coggins7
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Post by _Coggins7 »

No, Bob. You are the weak-minded fool who is eager to defend your magician-puppet masters to your dying breath. You have your head so far up your ass that you refuse to entertain any evidence regarding the man behind the curtain. You like that curtain pulled nice and tight against the wall so that you can't look behind it. In fact, you will gladly hold it shut just because someone else told you to. It is a waste of time interacting with you because you have no honest interest in facts or arguments that don't line up with your Mormon perspective.


Well, at least you didn't say 'backside". That's far to polite a term to use when your on a roll. I didn't understand until now that you had joined the ranks, with Scratch, of the tin foil brigades waiting for the UFO to bring JFK back to earth to inaugurate a new Camelot. Bush/Hitler/Monson, all the same. They're after your precious bodily fluids Trevor. The SCMC is fluoridating our water and putting microchips in our garments.

You may never, never know Trevor, in this life, how much fun at your expense you are providing here.
The face of sin today often wears the mask of tolerance.


- Thomas S. Monson
_Trevor
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Post by _Trevor »

Coggins7 wrote:Well, at least you didn't say 'backside". That's far to polite a term to use when your on a roll. I didn't understand until now that you had joined the ranks, with Scratch, of the tin foil brigades waiting for the UFO to bring JFK back to earth. Bush/Hitler/Monson, all the same. They're after your precious bodily fluids Trevor. The SCMC is flouridating our water and putting microchips in our garments.

You may never, never know Trevor, in this life, how much fun at your expense you are providing here.


I wouldn't be the least bit bothered if I am a source of humor for you, Coggins. I would view it as a positive complement. A kind of affirmation that I am on the right track.

Besides, anyone who can misread me as thoroughly as you do is certain to be able to find humor in all kinds of unexpected places.
“I was hooked from the start,” Snoop Dogg said. “We talked about the purpose of life, played Mousetrap, and ate brownies. The kids thought it was off the hook, for real.”
_Coggins7
_Emeritus
Posts: 3679
Joined: Fri Nov 03, 2006 12:25 am

Post by _Coggins7 »

Once again, Coggins seeks to reduce everything he reads to his simplistic, binary view of the universe. Replacing light and darkness, good and evil, and the other popular polar opposites of the past, is Coggins' "conservative and liberal", under which he has marshalled all other binary pair.


Observe. Although Trevor will never admit it (because to do so would place his real beliefs in the arena of ideas where they would be subject to the scathing disinfectant of light), this is a version of Postmodernism, which is the most radical and thorough repudiation of both the intellect and the moral imagination the western Left has yet constructed. Trevor is afraid of opposites and binary pairs because he is deathly afraid of being placed on one side or the other of them. To do so, to even accept indirectly, the premises that such opposites or dualisms exist, is to drive a stake through the very heart of the liberal's core assumption: that all values, all morality, and all choices are relative and arbitrary, and that the sovereign self can construct his own values and moralities as it goes along.

This is utterly terrifying to the liberal because it implies that he, yes he, the sovereign, liberal, liberated autonomous self is open to moral and value judgment. His behavior, his ideas, and his values can be called into question by a higher value system and potentially condemned as...yes...wrong, destructive, and even...evil. There can really be such a thing as right and wrong, higher and lower, good ideas and bad ideas, and good and evil. The leftist wants to transcend values because he seeks to exempt himself from the consequences of his own.

He can no longer pretend to be confused by the moral, ethical, political, or philosophical questions put before him in this life. He can no longer opt out of the great moral questions of the day, such as homosexual marriage, by simply declaring that no judgments can be passed and that therefore the only real evil is...the passing of judgment. He can no longer pretend to be moral by posing as an arbiter of all relative morality.


Furthermore, he is transparently trying to change the topic from his mind reading of Quinn to more of his political fiddle-faddle. Coggins pretends to know what motivated Quinn, drawing a conclusion that cuts against everything Quinn has ever said about his own motivations. Something tells me that Coggins is a crappy mindreader. Certainly this attempt has failed.


All I'm saying is that most of Quinn's work is transparently tendentious, which is not arguable. Quinn has never, to my knowledge, taken a strictly dispassionate position on anything he's ever written about in a mass market non-fiction book. His agenda is social and doctrinal change within the Church and he has never written a book on Mormon issues or history that does not overtly exude this overarching theme.
Last edited by Dr. Sunstoned on Tue Apr 15, 2008 10:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.
The face of sin today often wears the mask of tolerance.


- Thomas S. Monson
_rcrocket

Post by _rcrocket »

Trevor wrote:What we actually learn here is that Coggins, like crocket, is apparently unable to read. Well, I should give him more credit than that--he reads what he wants so he can launch into an irrelevant diatribe about modern liberalism.


Like I say, the veneer is very thin. I wonder what prompts you to think I don't read?

As to your resort to Quinn, does it trouble you in the least that his two "Power" books were not peer-reviewed as an academic work would ordinarily be? I can assure you that I have indeed read those works and followed some of his cites. The ones I have followed, without exception (of course, I was following the ones that caused my eyebrows to go sky-high) were abysmal overstatements.

I can also assure you that I am a liberal. This liberal socialist condemns claims without support.
Last edited by _rcrocket on Tue Apr 15, 2008 10:28 pm, edited 2 times in total.
_Coggins7
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Post by _Coggins7 »

Your request for "citations" is simply a species of denial.



And your inability to produce them is simply a species of your own intellectual charlatanry. An intellectual hack is known by his or her fruits, and Bob is just shaking the tree and we're watching the fruit drop all around us.

You have been caught and exposed in a particularly rich manner this time Scratch, but your inherent lack of integrity simply won't let you bow out gracefully.

So sad, really.
The face of sin today often wears the mask of tolerance.


- Thomas S. Monson
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