My Interview with Brian Hauglid is Up!

[_Dr Exiled]

There is a sudden groundswell of support for an interview of Kerry Shirts on Radio Free Mormon. What do you say Kerry?

Excellent idea!

[_Dr Moore]

There is a sudden groundswell of support for an interview of Kerry Shirts on Radio Free Mormon. What do you say Kerry?

+1

[_Fence Sitter]

John Gee says the other scroll is 41 feet long??

And yet was rolled up small enough to be gripped in a mummy's hand.

The Egyptians were very good at making papyri rolls. A 40' long roll is not unheard of and it would have fit underneath the crossed hands of a mummy. But there is only one problem. Such a roll would have been a tightly wound blank roll from which the sections of papyri used to make the Hor scroll would have been cut. The roll Gee used to make his arguments about the long roll was called the Toronto roll and in no way resembled the Hor scroll. Gee, once again, cherry picked his scroll facts to make his argument without telling his audience how he was waving his magic apologetic wand.

[_moksha]

The roll Gee used to make his arguments about the long roll was called the Toronto roll and in no way resembled the Hor scroll.

As long as sides of wasabi, soy, and pickled ginger were included in the sarcophagus a Toronto roll could work.

[_Doctor Scratch]

There is a sudden groundswell of support for an interview of Kerry Shirts on Radio Free Mormon. What do you say Kerry?

Excellent idea!

Absolutely. I'd definitely be interested in listening to that.

[_moksha]

There is a sudden groundswell of support for an interview of Kerry Shirts on Radio Free Mormon. What do you say Kerry?

I'm feeling it now. Seems to be at least a 6.7 on the RFM scale. Kerry would be tremendous. I am also sensing an after swell for a few direct from Scratch questions for Kerry.

[_Chap]

Shulem
Professor Gee will have to come to terms and figure out what to do with his dying faith in the Book of Abraham translation. Isn't that right, Gee? Perhaps you can write a book on how to save faith. That should sustain you for a while at least.

Writing a book with actual and verifiable facts would be vastly superior........ :biggrin: Gee tried to write about how faith verified a longer roll using mathematics and Chris Smith and his co-author destroyed him with accurate mathematics, not faith mathematical facts. Mathematical facts that Gee's faith cannot refute.

I followed that discussion closely. It ran over several months. The mathematics involved was relatively simple, and it soon became clear that Gee simply did not understand the way the calculations worked: he had made elementary mistakes in his reasoning. By the time Chris Smith and Mortal Man had written up their work in full, there was no room for doubt that Gee's 'long scroll' theory was a mathematical and physical impossibility.

No rocket science was involved. It is not difficult to work out the maximum possible total length of a spirally wound roll, given that the spacing of the recurrent lines of damage caused by folding when the scroll was squashed makes it easy to calculated the diameters of the relevant layers of the roll That leads on to a calculation of the maximum total possible length in the roll. Gee got that wrong.

See the account given in:

Smith, Christopher C. “‘That Which Is Lost’: Assessing the State of Preservation of the Joseph Smith Papyri.” The John Whitmer Historical Association Journal, vol. 31, no. 1, 2011, pp. 69–83. JSTOR, www.jstor.org/stable/43200509. Accessed 15 July 2020. From this I quote:

Another important line of evidence regarding the original length of the Hor
scroll is the evidence of the existing fragments themselves. The fragments are
from the outer end of the scroll, which means they were wrapped around the
inner portion whose length we would like to know. Only a finite amount of
papyrus could have fit within these bounds. If we can determine the lengths of
severed successive wrappings from the outer portion, simple spiral geometry
can be used to determine the probable length of the lost interior portion.
The difficulty in applying this method lies in accurately determining
the original wrap lengths. Repeating patterns of damage to the upper and
lower edges of the papyrus are the key. These repeating patterns result from
damage incurred by the scroll prior to being unrolled. The distance between
two successive, matching damage patterns is the length of one winding.
Unfortunately, the act of manually finding matching reference points for
measurement is a subjective and difficult task. In 2008, John Gee visually
examined the papyrus and proposed 9.7 and 9.5 cm (about 3.8 and 3.7 inches)
as the lengths of the first and seventh windings. Based on these figures, Gee
concluded that 1250.5 cm (about 41 feet) of papyrus could be missing from the
interior end of the scroll of Hor.46 When I checked Gee's measurements against
some photographs of the papyri, however, I achieved quite different results.
This led Andrew Cook and me to devise a less subjective method of measuring
the distance between successive lacunae.
In order to obtain more reliable measurements, we first traced the upper
and lower edges of the original papyrus from the church archives and digitized
these tracings. We then used a computerized method called "autocorrelation"
to determine the horizontal distance that each damaged section must be shifted
in order to optimally match the successive damaged section. The lower edge of
the papyrus was used as a check against the findings from the upper edge
order to ensure accuracy. Our method returned 56 cm (about 22 inches) as the
probable length of the missing portion, which agrees well with Klaus Baer's
estimate of 59 cm (about 23 inches) of papyrus missing from the Document of
Breathing. Given this finding, it does not seem physically possible that another
text followed the Document of Breathing on the Hor scroll.

You can download a pdf of an earlier article with full details of the figures and calculations here:

Andrew W. Cook and Christopher C. Smith, "The Original Length of the Scroll of Hör," Dialogue : A Journal of Mormon Thought 43, no. 4 (Winter 2010): 1-42

But did Gee retract? Guess.

[_Shulem]

William Schryver, where are you?

sup?

Will,

I think it would be marvelous if you were to appear (in voice) on Radio Free Mormon. Don't you think that would be fun? I think it works for everyone, especially you, whereby you can express yourself to an audience that really wants to hear you speak from the heart.

How about that, consiglieri? don't you think hosting William Schryver on your show would be a smash hit? I'm pretty sure you'd pick up a lot of new listeners and then everybody can know more about the real William Schryver whom I suspect is a good person who has been through a lot.

We want want William!
We want want William!
We want want William!

[_consiglieri]

All are welcome! All welcome!

This house has many hearts!

But first I want Kerry!

[_Shulem]

All are welcome! All welcome!

This house has many hearts!

But first I want Kerry!

Right. Right. Of course. I can't imagine Kerry not jumping at the chance to be on your show.

Where is Kerry? Hey Kerry! Are U there?