Mister Scratch wrote: No, Charity. You said that Ph.D.s in Mormon Studies would become viable once "Yale and Harvard put out the hiring notices for ph. d.'s in the field." What does this mean? It means that pursuing a Ph.D. in Mormon Studies is only worthwhile if it nets you a job: hence, mercenary.
Let me say it one more time: It means that pursuing in a ph. d. of ANY kind is only ultimately worthwhile if it allows you to get a job.
UNLESS: You don't need a job at all and you have upwards of $100,00 to spend just on indulging your interests.
Mister Scratch wrote: No, Charity. You said that Ph.D.s in Mormon Studies would become viable once "Yale and Harvard put out the hiring notices for ph. d.'s in the field." What does this mean? It means that pursuing a Ph.D. in Mormon Studies is only worthwhile if it nets you a job: hence, mercenary.
Let me say it one more time: It means that pursuing in a ph. d. of ANY kind is only ultimately worthwhile if it allows you to get a job.
Right... That's basically what I've been saying all along, Charity. You think that pursuing a doctorate should only be about the money/job. The subject matter, the notion of contributing and generating knowledge, the love of it: all of this is of subsidiary importance at best.
UNLESS: You don't need a job at all and you have upwards of $100,00 to spend just on indulging your interests.
Wow, you know, it is so weird that you are actually arguing against BYU having a Mormon Studies Ph.D. Quite amazing!
Mister Scratch wrote: Wow, you know, it is so weird that you are actually arguing against BYU having a Mormon Studies Ph.D. Quite amazing!
Do you know that schools usually do not hire their own ph.d. graduates? So where do they look for a job? Oh, right, I forgot. They got their degrees in the field because they love it. And now they are going out to work at the local Home Depot with their ph.d.'s.
Mister Scratch wrote: Wow, you know, it is so weird that you are actually arguing against BYU having a Mormon Studies Ph.D. Quite amazing!
Do you know that schools usually do not hire their own ph.d. graduates?
It depends on the field and it depends on the institution. I have little doubt that BYU---or other Church organizations---would be delighted to employ Ph.D.s in Mormon Studies.
So where do they look for a job? Oh, right, I forgot. They got their degrees in the field because they love it. And now they are going out to work at the local Home Depot with their ph.d.'s.
Do you want BYU to offer a doctorate in Mormon Studies or not, Charity? Y/N?
If one carried Scratch's argument to fruition, studying all those years to get a Ph.D would give one a great deal of satisfaction as they serve shoe customers at J.C. Penneys. Then on their off time - they would still need to pay the rent - they could contribute and generate knowledge due to their love of it.
I think they would be better served learning auto mechanics and posting at MAD in their spare time. The world needs more good auto mechanics.
beastie wrote:Isn't part of the point wondering why a doctorate in Mormon studies would render one unemployable?
Even if a doctorate in Mormon Studies would render the candidate unemployable, why doesn't BYU offer a doctorate in Biblical Studies? Plenty of schools have opening in their Religious Studies department for people with PhD's in Biblical Studies.
moksha wrote:If one carried Scratch's argument to fruition, studying all those years to get a Ph.D would give one a great deal of satisfaction as they serve shoe customers at J.C. Penneys. Then on their off time - they would still need to pay the rent - they could contribute and generate knowledge due to their love of it.
I think they would be better served learning auto mechanics and posting at MAD in their spare time. The world needs more good auto mechanics.
No, no, no. My point is that getting a Ph.D. involves more than simply wanting (or needing) to get a job. There are a lot better ways to earn lots of money than getting a Ph.D.
I couldn't find this thread and posted on another one. But Moksha, you are no doubt correct. When a person spends $100,000 on a ph . d., he wants to be employable. We are a lay church. We don't hire bishops. Seminarians fully expect to take their degrees in hand and take paid ministerial positions. CES employees don't need ph.d.'s in specificalized fields. And even they don't make the big bucks.
I expect BYU will start offering ph.d.'s in Book of Mormon studies when Yale and Harvard put out the hiring notices for ph. d.'s in the field.
We aren't talking about CES employees, we are talking about the big scholarly FARMS and Maxwell institute which you and others tout as serious scholarly venues. Yet, not even BYU, today, would let the kind of work they do at FARMS pass for graduate work that they'd be willing to endorse by granting a degree.
Lou Midgley 08/20/2020: "...meat wad," and "cockroach" are pithy descriptions of human beings used by gemli? They were not fashioned by Professor Peterson.
LM 11/23/2018: one can explain away the soul of human beings...as...a Meat Unit, to use Professor Peterson's clever derogatory description of gemli's ideology.