Book of Mormon apologetic of last resort?

[_mikwut]

Sethbag,

You find me a thousand random believers from around the world and find for me the things they think "the Spirit" has told them, and demonstrate anything like the precise agreement that we see with the other (ie: the real) senses, and then we'll talk.

That God Exists.

That God loves me.

That love exists.

That I sin.

That I experience "faith".

That I experience "repentance".

That I experience "growth/development" spiritually.

Of course I was unable to randomly produce the thousand believers, but you seem like a nice a fellow that we could talk anyway.

regards, mikwut

[_beastie]

That God Exists.

That God loves me.

That love exists.

That I sin.

That I experience "faith".

That I experience "repentance".

That I experience "growth/development" spiritually.

Of course I was unable to randomly produce the thousand believers, but you seem like a nice a fellow that we could talk anyway.

This seems to verify my assertion that ambiguous revelation is not conducive to authoritative statements such as the LDS church is the only church with the "true" priesthood of JC.

[_EAllusion]

Indeed, one of the reasons "spiritual sight" is not analogous to an accepted cognitive process like seeing a cactus is the lack of intersubjectivity.

[_mikwut]

Tarski,

Define Truth.

mikwut

[_mikwut]

E,

My memory lacks intersubjectivity.

mikwut

[_EAllusion]

E,

My memory lacks intersubjectivity.

mikwut

As do many things that you see. If you are the only person who sees a cactus, that does not mean you should question your vision unless others are there and not seeing it. The process of memory does not lack intersubjectivty, which is why we are able to understand on a relatively sophisticated level the reliability of various memories. The ability to independently corroborate memory with other subjects is there in a way it is not for the divine sense - or if you are adventurous - alien sense.

[_mikwut]

E,

I disagree. That God exists has been corroborated by the vast majority of mankind.

mikwut

[_beastie]

I disagree. That God exists has been corroborated by the vast majority of mankind.

Belief does not equate corroboration.

[_EAllusion]

E,

I disagree. That God exists has been corroborated by the vast majority of mankind.

mikwut

It's true that a large % of people have believed in gods. It is not true that that that same % of people have arrived at that belief via sensus divinitus. It also is not true that that belief has demonstrated intersubjectivity that is in any way analogous to more commonly accepted faculties. If God were a cactus in the analogy, people would differ wildly in the color, size, shape, location, and fundamental properties of the cactus.

[_Scottie]

Why not just release a new and improved Book of Mormon? All they need to do is add a few verses that mention Native Americans already being here, and how the Nephites mixed their seed with them. Change horses to horse-like creatures. TAke out the reference to dark skin being evil, and change it to dark countenance or spirit. It woudn't take much editing, just a few new verses here and there and a couple changes. "And we arrived and the promised land and discovered many natives working in the fields. And we befriended them, and I prophecy that these natives will help us build a temple here, but I fearest that many of my people shall mingle their seed amongst the natives so as their blood shall flow through my posterity."

Easy, and the members would eat it up.

You know, this isn't a bad idea. Sure, it would produce a small backlash for a few years, but in the long run it could further PROVE the Book of Mormon is true. Oh, sure, critics will decry the changes forever, but apologists can simply say that prophets are called to further clarify, which is exactly what they have done! And they weren't major changes anyways...just minor typos and spelling errors. You know, horse to horse-like and steel to obsidian. The parts that affect their salvation are still intact.

Hell, why not throw in some more things that Joseph Smith could not have known in his day. That way apologists in 50 years could say, "There is NO WAY Joseph Smith could have known this!!!"