sock puppet wrote:At Holland and Nelson's press conference after the 1st Saturday Session, Nelson in particular assured the press that the COB correlated teaching materials (new) are geared to preparing the youth for missionary service by age 18.
If a parent, this would have me very concerned that the LDS Church has just ratcheted up its efforts to program the youth into making a positive mission decision. If you want your kids to make an informed decision for themselves, you'll have to not only become involved sooner because of the reduction in age to begin a mission, but you'll need to take greater effort to provide your children the countervailing evidence and options, so that they may actually make a decision for themselves, free of the pressure (institutional and peer) of the LDS Church.
Are these new materials available now or is there an ETA?
Oh, and good advice on making lemons out of lemonade. I definitely will have to accelerate the information process, that was already a given. But these new materials may make it happen even sooner if they are really atrocious.
Nelson indicated that they've recently rolled out these new materials that he was referring to at today's noon press conference. I do not have any link or other information about how you can access them.
have not seen this mentioned anywhere yet - the temple.
if these kids choose to go after high school, they will go in jun-aug so they don't mess up another school year. that means kids will be getting mission calls while in high school, going to the temple while in high school, and getting a new name and garments. this is insanity. absolute insanity.
the first round of mission calls will go in by march, though, given the rush to get a june slot, kids may be putting in papers earlier.
there is going to have to be a lot of revelation to manage this strange decision. and to think, its because kids are leaving the church and being wayward after they leave home. what better than to force more conflict on these kids while they are in high school. so lovely, and such a cult.
"Rocks don't speak for themselves" is an unfortunate phrase to use in defense of a book produced by a rock actually 'speaking' for itself... (I have a Question, 5.15.15)
Mayan Elephant wrote:have not seen this mentioned anywhere yet - the temple.
if these kids choose to go after high school, they will go in jun-aug so they don't mess up another school year. that means kids will be getting mission calls while in high school, going to the temple while in high school, and getting a new name and garments. this is insanity. absolute insanity.
the first round of mission calls will go in by march, though, given the rush to get a june slot, kids may be putting in papers earlier.
there is going to have to be a lot of revelation to manage this strange decision. and to think, its because kids are leaving the church and being wayward after they leave home. what better than to force more conflict on these kids while they are in high school. so lovely, and such a cult.
I just can't imagine what it will be like for the kids who want out and have both parents and family pushing them to serve a mission. What will it be like for them? What are their options? Move out? Move out while they're still in high school?
The lucky ones will be those who have parents like Aristotle. At least those kids will have someone telling them the other half of the story.
Stormy Waters wrote:I just can't imagine what it will be like for the kids who want out and have both parents and family pushing them to serve a mission. What will it be like for them? What are their options? Move out? Move out while they're still in high school?
The lucky ones will be those who have parents like Aristotle. At least those kids will have someone telling them the other half of the story.
Yes, this new, reduced age eligibility rule gives parents that do not respect their children as individuals who may choose their own paths another arrow in the quiver to use to prevent their children from deciding for themselves.
Aristotle Smith wrote:I did not appreciate the announced age change for missionaries. For me, this will have practical consequences.
I live in a mixed faith marriage, my wife is TBM, I am no longer Mormon. This creates difficulties in what each of us can tell the kids and when they are told certain things. Up until now my plan was to hold off on telling my kids the real facts about LDS history and doctrine until they were older. I didn't have a firm time frame in mind, but 18 years old seemed like a good time to tell my sons. At that point it's not really an issue of educating minors, but it would really be more of an adult to adult conversation. Plus, having graduated from high school would give them a chance to feel like they were more adult before I told them anything too negative. They would be more mature and could make their own choices at that point. Most importantly, it would give them a chance to think about things before heading off on a mission, or to decide to forego the mission, or to just leave the church entirely.
Now that's no longer an option. I now have to have that conversation earlier than I wanted. They will be minors which means I won't have the luxury of talking to them as adults. They won't be as mature. There will be more possibilities for conflict between my wife and myself.
This pisses me off.
I am sorry this complicates things for you. Really I am. To me, this is clearly a move to get more YM and YWCA serve, to retain YM who often fall away after HS. Boys who don't go to a church schools are more apr to fall away. What better way to keep them than to have them go straight from HS, priests quorum, youth activities, seminary, etc straight to a mission. For families such as yours it does cause further dilemma. I am not sure what I would do. You may have to expose them to some things earlier than you planned which opens up another hole can of worms for you. Best wishes in all this.
I must say that I am so glad three of my four children as adults. My youngest is 17 and is a thinker. She and in have discusse religion a lot. I have encouraged her to read, study and search all sides of things herself and then make her own decisions. She knowsminhace lots of questions and I have shared some in general though not details. My wife does not favor me even discussing such things with my adult kids, which I do anyway.
This was designed to keep kids living at home and fully under their parents' wings until they're dropped off at the MTC. It's not so much about age as it is about removing the time period kids have to get life experience.
18 year old kids who have never moved out of their parents house is now the standard for missionaries. Are they really expecting them to produce conversions and baptisms? Heck no, they gave up on the idea of missionaries converting the nations a long time ago. The key is it's a corporation, and this is the 80/20 rule- most activity and tithe paying is in the Mormon Corridor, so they're focusing on retaining their 80 instead of the 20. Keeping old customers is much, much easier than making new ones.
Truth is missions within the LDS culture is a glorified rite of passage that is absolutely central to our culture- like a bar mitzvah for jewish men or a hajj for muslims. It hasn't been about converting and then baptizing for decades, why else would they send children?
Harold Lee wrote:Truth is missions within the LDS culture is a glorified rite of passage that is absolutely central to our culture- like a bar mitzvah for jewish men or a hajj for muslims. It hasn't been about converting and then baptizing for decades, why else would they send children?
I don't recall a bar mitzvah lasting two years and being isolated from your family, friends and loved ones almost completely for the entire time. Do you get your passport taken off you for your bar mitzvah?
Would you say it is a rite of passage that is absolutely central for the women of your culture?
“We look to not only the spiritual but also the temporal, and we believe that a person who is impoverished temporally cannot blossom spiritually.” Keith McMullin - Counsellor in Presiding Bishopric
"One, two, three...let's go shopping!" Thomas S Monson - Prophet, Seer, Revelator
Jason Bourne wrote:I must say that I am so glad three of my four children as adults. My youngest is 17 and is a thinker. She and in have discusse religion a lot. I have encouraged her to read, study and search all sides of things herself and then make her own decisions. She knowsminhace lots of questions and I have shared some in general though not details. My wife does not favor me even discussing such things with my adult kids, which I do anyway.
If the church offered non proselytizing service missions, I would encourage my children to go. They don't, and I never will.
I agree that a male being a Mormon missionary is a right of passage to adulthood.
But I don't think the hajj is a very good example. All kinds of adult Muslim men have never been on the hajj and they are accepted as fully adult males in their community.
In Islam, if there is a definitive adult right of passage, it is more likely to have been adopted from the local culture and thus vary greatly.
The closest Islam comes is circumcision in those communities that delay it until just before puberty, being old enought to fast for Ramadan, and getting married.
"And the human knew the source of life, the woman of him, and she conceived and bore Cain, and said, 'I have procreated a man with Yahweh.'" Gen. 4:1, interior quote translated by D. Bokovoy.