Comparative Biographies of Warren Aston, Discoverer of Nahom

[_Kishkumen]

I am sure that I am not the only person who deeply, deeply appreciates that Jenkins decided to take on a Mormon apologist on strict academic grounds.

I still get teary-eyed thinking about it. And I mean in a good way.

[Guest]

So, just because someone has interest in a subject that is not "mainstream" means what?

Almost everyone believes that UFO's and "other life" likely exists, so how are people who explore that subject somehow "crazy"?
UFO's are a well excepted fact by most people.... thus clearly not just crazy people believe in them.
Sure, some might be nuts, as we all know for obvious reasons, so what's the problem again of a Mormon out there having such an interest.

Like I said, nothing but bigotry.

It's one thing to believe that life out there probably exists. And I don't think there is anything wrong with having an interest or open mind about UFO stories, as long as one listens and considers the claims with an appropriate level of skepticism. But believing that there is "overwhelming evidence that earth is being, and has always been, visited by a variety of extra-terrestrial races" is out there. Way out there.

Ditto crypto-zoology.

It frankly depends on "how far" such is believed....
If one takes the scientific approach to things, it's entirely valid to see evidences of things that do exist, and to see that certain things are not or likely true.
Aston is clearly a scientist who uses the scientific method in his research, thus it's entirely valid for him to do so if that's his interest.

You or me being ignorant of the field simply because there are false examples out there, doesn't make it all somehow "invalid".

Further, there is another important point.....
It's a well known fact in life that people can be entirely right and normal in some or many things, but be entirely false, wrong, or off in some other things.
Even IF he's a bit of a "quack" in relation to UFO's or otherwise, that doesn't mean he's a "quack" in all of his work.
Smart people judge things by their merits, not by personality's of faults in some things.

His work in Book of Mormon study's has been excellent, and completely valid and mainstream.
Other work and interests he has doesn't somehow invalidate something else.
But, that's how liberals/anti-Mormons judge things. If they see any flaw, they throw the baby out with the bath water.

[_Maksutov]

It's one thing to believe that life out there probably exists. And I don't think there is anything wrong with having an interest or open mind about UFO stories, as long as one listens and considers the claims with an appropriate level of skepticism. But believing that there is "overwhelming evidence that earth is being, and has always been, visited by a variety of extra-terrestrial races" is out there. Way out there.

Ditto crypto-zoology.

It frankly depends on "how far" such is believed....
If one takes the scientific approach to things, it's entirely valid to see evidences of things that do exist, and to see that certain things are not or likely true.
Aston is clearly a scientist who uses the scientific method in his research, thus it's entirely valid for him to do so if that's his interest.

You or me being ignorant of the field simply because there are false examples out there, doesn't make it all somehow "invalid".

Show us Aston's scientific credentials.

[_Kishkumen]

Maybe crypto-zoology could shed some light on cureloms.

Cureloms and cumoms are the best things the Book of Mormon brought to the world.

Well, them and the Jaredites.

If only the Jaredites had not been tainted with an artistic representation that can only be called not-too-thinly-veiled child pornography:

[_ldsfaqs]

A person can be considered a scientist because they use the scientific method and study out things.
I'm speaking in general terms. One doesn't have to have "credentials" to be a scientist.

This was very normal in past times in history, where people just did scientific work, they weren't generally "credentialed".
It's an elitist who thinks one HAS to be credentialed in order for anything they do to be considered "valid".

[_Darth J]

If ufology is a perfectly legitimate undertaking, then I have to ask myself why faith-promoting sources invariably leave that off Brother Aston's biography.

[_Maksutov]

A person can be considered a scientist because they use the scientific method and study out things.
I'm speaking in general terms. One doesn't have to have "credentials" to be a scientist.

This was very normal in past times in history, where people just did scientific work, they weren't generally "credentialed".
It's an elitist who thinks one HAS to be credentialed in order for anything they do to be considered "valid".

You might have been right in 1600. We've moved on. Do you think that self-appointed, opinionated people with no education can do what NASA does? Silly faqs.

Aston is a crackpot. Just like John Heinerman and John Pratt and that dude who thinks the galaxy shows the three degrees of glory. Just like the 'scientists' who proclaim hollow earth tribes from the north. Just like the angel mine believers.

[_Darth J]

This is how the Jenga blocks are stacked: Warren Aston is the principal proponent of the site that Mopologists assert to be the Nahom mentioned in the Book of Mormon. For a substantial fee, Aston takes credulous Mormons on a tour of places he asserts to be the actual location of Lehi's journey. Aston is also very prominent in the UFO community. He has written extensively about the idea that space aliens are visiting our planet, disguised as humans.

Due to the influence of Mopologetics, Warren Aston's credibility has become connected to LDS truth claims. Official LDS curricula and magazines, BYU Studies, and essentially every Mopologist outlet tout Warren Aston's unsupported speculation about the NHM altars as clear evidence that the Book of Mormon narrative really happened.

If Aston's credibility is challenged, by implication you are challenging the truthfulness of the Book of Mormon and therefore Mormonism altogether. QED: the response of believing Mormons every time anyone on the internet notices that Aston is a crank. Granted that Ldsfaqs has a couple of, umm, issues, notice how quickly he reacted to my simply demonstrating that faith-promoting sources invariably omit any reference to Aston's ufology, even though the amount of work he has done in that arena far surpasses what he has done with "Book of Mormon archaeology" (scare quotes intentional).

Obviously, defenders of the faith have a modicum of self-awareness in realizing that it looks bad to say Mormon apologetics and ufology in the same breath, since the association is less than flattering. The thing is, there's no appreciable difference in either methodology or substance between ufology and Book of Mormon apologetics (cf. ancient aliens), other than "the Book of Mormon is special to me."

To receive the verdict of "anti-Mormon" (best heard in your head as a screech in Honey Lovejoy's voice), you need only do any of the following:

* Point out Brother Aston's extensive career in the UFO community
* Point out that the above is decidedly left out of Brother Aston's credentials in faith-promoting sources
* Point out that Brother Aston has a vested financial interest in touting certain Middle Eastern places as actual Book of Mormon historical sites.

And that's it. The faithful will fill in the blanks, and the implications write themselves.

[_Analytics]

To receive the verdict of "anti-Mormon" (best heard in your head as a screech in Honey Lovejoy's voice), you need only do any of the following:

* Point out Brother Aston's extensive career in the UFO community
* Point out that the above is decidedly left out of Brother Aston's credentials in faith-promoting sources
* Point out that Brother Aston has a vested financial interest in touting certain Middle Eastern places as actual Book of Mormon historical sites.

And that's it. The faithful will fill in the blanks, and the implications write themselves.

It's amazing how well you proved this in this thread. You literally did nothing other than quote a few published bios, and were immediately accused of making an anti-Mormon rant.

[_I have a question]

Cannot believe those lds bios missed this type of content...

Confronts the overwhelming evidence that earth is being, and has always been, visited by a variety of extra-terrestrial races, from LDS (Mormon) perspectives.

The author is both LDS and a long-time UFO researcher and lecturer and offers opportunities for the reality of the alien presence on earth to be assessed from a unique vantage point. This collection of papers is intended to encourage greater awareness and further discussion among Mormons.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Mormon-Looks-A ... B009KWN89O

The book includes two chapters on the ongoing Amicizia ("Friendship") case involving hundreds of participants since 1956. The material includes a daytime color image of an alien crew member and the transcrpt of a crew conversation during a flight and landing.

I'm hearing rumors of a follow up by Aston called "Nephites Probed My Butt"