G.Palmer Mormon Discussions Podcast on Joseph Smith Sexual Allegations

[Schreech]

Chap, my brain always wants to think of the exceptions, in terms of society. So if you have some isolated group, where a lot of the men suddenly get killed off, then I can see them logically instituting polygamy.

(Tobin, there is also a tradition of Muslims marrying first cousins. I've taught many of the children of such families, and a good few of their brothers and sisters have severe mental and physical disabilities because of the closeness of the gene pool.)

In modern western society I don't think there's any need for society to practice polygamy, and in that way I agree with Chap.

[_Equality]

I find it odd that none of the women he was married to recanted or accussed Joseph Smith of being morally depraved as they matured and reflected on what occurred.

If one of his plural wives had done as you suggest, would you find her credible? Or would you doubt her credibility as one who was just trying to get back at Joseph? If Jane Law had accepted Joseph Smith's proposal, "married" him, and then later recanted and accused him of being morally depraved would you then find her credible?

[_RockSlider]

consiglieri,

This is what also struck me. I noted in the thread that Ray pointed out eariler that Shades' made mention of this same thing ... Shades where had you heard this before? Anyone else?

In trying to read through the Expositor a bit closer, looking for hints to this, I did not see it.

[_Tobin]

In modern western society I don't think there's any need for society to practice polygamy, and in that way I agree with Chap.

I don't think modern Western society has much to brag about either. There is a lot of abuse of women in Western society, particularly around prostitution and the pornography business.

[_Buffalo]

In modern western society I don't think there's any need for society to practice polygamy, and in that way I agree with Chap.

I don't think modern Western society has much to brag about either. There is a lot of abuse of women in Western society, particularly around prostitution and the pornography business.

Not to mention polygamy.

[_Tobin]

Not to mention polygamy.

Oh yes, because polygamy is wide spread in Western society. Clearly it is a major concern.

[_Buffalo]

Not to mention polygamy.

Oh yes, because polygamy is wide spread in Western society. Clearly it is a major concern.

Didn't say it was. But where instituted, it's clearly bad for women.

[_just me]

In modern western society I don't think there's any need for society to practice polygamy, and in that way I agree with Chap.

I don't think modern Western society has much to brag about either. There is a lot of abuse of women in Western society, particularly around prostitution and the pornography business.

Yeah, and barring women from the priesthood and ecclesiastical positions.

[_Joe Geisner]

Listening to part 2 of the interview this morning, Palmer answered a question nagging at me since a couple of years back when I read D&C 132 and wondered what the heck verse 51 was talking about:

Verily, I say unto you: A commandment I give unto mine handmaid, Emma Smith, your wife, whom I have given unto you, that she stay herself and partake not of that which I commanded you to offer unto her; for I did it, saith the Lord, to prove you all, as I did Abraham, and that I might require an offering at your hand, by covenant and sacrifice.

Excellent observations consiglieri. There is more evidence for this line of reasoning. William Clayton wrote this is his diary June 23,1843. Besides this entry being a clear statement that blood atonement was alive and well in Nauvoo, Brigham Young as not Joseph Smith's friend (ever), and we have evidence of both Thompson and Knight's death being very suspicious; we also have evidence with this entry that Emma was looking to seduce Clayton to take revenge on Joseph.

June 23,1843
"This A.M. Prest J[oseph] took me and conversed considerable concerning some delicate matters. said E[mma] wanted to lay a snare for me. He told me last night of this and said he had felt troubled. He said E[mma] had treated him coldly & badly since I came and he knew she was disposed to be revenged on him for some things she thought that if he would indulge himself she would too. He cautioned me very kindly for which I felt thankful. He said [Robert] Thompson professed great friendship for him but he gave way to temptation & he had to die. Also bro [Vinson]Knight he gave him one but he went to loose conduct and he could not save him. Also B[righam] Y[oung] had transgressed his covenant & he pled with the Lord to spare him this end & he did so, other wise he would have died. B[righam] denied having transgressed. He said if I would do right by him & abide his council he would save my life while he lived. I feel desirous to do right & would rather die than loose my interest in the celestial kingdom."

[_Mary]

Joe, I just checked this website

http://saintswithouthalos.com/b/thompson_r.phtml

Which suggests that Robert died of the unhealthy conditions working on the Times and Seasons.

And that Joseph told him to take a holiday and get drunk, otherwise he would die.

Grief, early LDS history is such a minefield...