Do You Believe in Life After Death?

[_Inconceivable]

Just to be clear, while again I have seen some incredible life altering experiences from regression, I am not convinced these experiences are what they seem to be.

~td~

Thanks TD (finally).

I agree.

Yet, what a remarkable event. It's pleasing to note that this regression tended to bring a perspective to his life that brought balance, closure and peace. Not just to himself but to those around him.

I'd like to know more.

[_marg]

..there is the belief that the more one reads about each "near death experiences" that quantity of personal accounts, is evidence of truth in actuality that a life after death exists.

This actually sounds logical to me, marg. The objective person will seek for patterns (whether they agree with their assumptions/paradigms or not). At very least, consistancy ought to give us a tendency to lean or believe. Perhaps we ought to call them current theories rather than beliefs.

The quantity of related experiences by independant reasonably credible individuals is good evidence that the experiences exist. The interpretation by individuals who either are unaware, uninterested or unable to critically evaluate a scientific interpretation is the problem. Most people who believe 'after death experiences" actually happened, in that a soul left the body and could actually see, think, hear etc have not examined critically well the scientific explanation. So what I was saying is that the quantity of a poorly reasoned conclusion is not a good reason to accept that conclusion.

I think there are many people who no matter how much they read about "near death experiences" will not examine the evidence critically well and they will be no further ahead by the sheer volume of experiences. The experiences are real, it is the interpretation which tends to be weak.

Now, for those that live within a world the size of a box of matches (like Nightlion), you will notice that they cease to recognize or evaluate external stimulus in an objective way. In other words they have rendered themselves incapable of seeing the rest of the world from anyone elses perspective but their very own narrow view.

Some people are able to be objective, non-emotional, unattached to beliefs generally and examine information critically well. Some can do it with most of the information they are presented, some can do it with only a portion of the information. I haven't been reading Nightlion's posts all that much. He may think critically well on some areas and not well in others.

Just because something actually exists doesn't mean we understand it for what it is. I used to think I understood how I gave priesthood blessings conveying messages and healing people. Now I don't particularly understand at all. It still doesn't make it any less real.

Sure your blessings were real, but if they were reliable doctors and medicine would be unnecessary. What sort of objective testing did you do to determine whether your blessing worked with significant frequency? What sort of predictive value did your blessing have? When a doctor prescribes medicine is because that medicine has been objectively tested and it's been verified to work effectively with a certain amount of predictability.

[_truth dancer]

Hi Inc,

Just to be clear, while again I have seen some incredible life altering experiences from regression, I am not convinced these experiences are what they seem to be.

~td~

Thanks TD (finally).

I agree.

Yet, what a remarkable event. It's pleasing to note that this regression tended to bring a perspective to his life that brought balance, closure and peace. Not just to himself but to those around him.

I'd like to know more.

LOL!

More about what?

Here is the thing about multiple lives... the Karmic model is that we have many, many, many lives and continue to incarnate until we reach Moksha, (not our penguin friend), or freedom.

But the numbers don't add up. There are about 6.7 billion people on the earth and only about 60 billion people who have ever lived, (going with the idea that humans became a species about 150,000 years ago), so it doesn't seem possible that we could each have millions of lives. (At least not on this earth). And, there are quite a few people who believe they are the reincarnation of famous people, like Jesus Christ.

On the other hand, some of the stories are pretty amazing and I have had a series of memories from what would appear another life. They are extraordinary and as real as any real memory.

Here is my take, (seriously open to change). Since we know that with every breath, we take into our form particles that create our body/mind from literally every life form that has ever existed on our planet, and since the material of which we are made has been "reincarnated" or reused, or transformed billions of times, it seems possible that there is some sort of memory that may be associated with particles we share.

Or, there is some sort of shared consciousness that we have the possibility of tapping into on occasion, (think zero point energy field, or seamlessness, or quantum vacuum, or whatever one wants to call it).

I truly believe we are at the very, VERY beginning of grasping a tiny speck of that which is our universe. We are limited to experiencing only that which is available to our extremely limited senses, and so I believe that there are probably all sorts of things we can't even imagine that yet exist. I mean germs existed before we discovered them; gravity didn't just come into existence when Newton put a name to it; and evolution was happening long before Darwin and Wallace.

Or maybe we do return for more lives... personally, it makes more sense than the weird test where people get one shot and eternity is set in stone.

Who knows?
~td~

[_Jersey Girl]

Hi Bracki,

I like this poll! I checked "I don't know" because I really don't know and I don't know how I can know. :-) There are some questions you could ask me and I'd know exactly what the answer is. On this topic, I think two different ways. I'm a Pisces and if you know what that symbol is, it's two fishes swimming in opposite directions. That exactly represents my thinking about life after death. I am of two minds. Fish minds!

Fish #1: Says that human beings are so remarkable that a Creator must have made us and our spirits/souls continue on in some way even if we are recycled throughout the ages. (Note: A long, long time ago Gad accused me of being a Buddhist :-) That (here comes my craziness) death is simply a birth and not something to be feared. Of course I have the human desire to see my loved ones again, so I also hold out a hope that it's possible. I (don't tell anyone I said this, okay?) talk to my mother who is deceased. I will never stop doing that. Is she somewhere and can she hear me? I don't know. I just talk to her. I was with her the moment that she died and I knew that she wasn't there any more. Was she some place else? I won't know until I know or I won't know anything at all ever again. I'm okay with that.

Fish #2: Says that dead human beings are exactly the same as dead animals or anything else that is dead. Just dead matter that if placed properly can feed/nourish living matter in the sense that we can become soil content. It wigs me out that human beings choose to embalm the dead bodies of their loved ones so they can view the dead body. It use to seem so normal to me, but now I find it just over-the-top ridiculous to do.

In any case, I try to live like there's no tomorrow. That is to say, if I see someone in need, I try to extend myself for them. Instead of life after death, I think in terms of life after life. Whatever I might do that makes someone's life better is what I want to leave behind me after I "live". I think the best thing you can leave behind you is the imprint you have left on the life of another, not necessarily the memory of you, but something you have contributed to their future. I work with young children so I have a chance to live out that philosophy every single day. There isn't anything better than that!

So yeah. I don't know. :-D

[_Inconceivable]

Here is the thing about multiple lives... the Karmic model is that we have many, many, many lives and continue to incarnate until we reach Moksha, We are limited to experiencing only that which is available to our extremely limited senses, and so I believe that there are probably all sorts of things we can't even imagine that yet exist.

Or maybe we do return for more lives... personally, it makes more sense than the weird test where people get one shot and eternity is set in stone.
~td~

Thanks for your take on this. There's a peace about you and that makes what you say worth considering.

I have a tendency to believe that the elements that make up our bodies are just that. The Karmic model seems to make sense. I suppose if we were aware that it was a truth, we may not take our current life so seriously or place such a high value on the lives of others.

[_truth dancer]

H Inc,

I suppose if we were aware that it was a truth, we may not take our current life so seriously or place such a high value on the lives of others.

Actually, my observation is that those who truly understand and believe in the Karmic model place a very high value on the lives of others and take life quite seriously.

Because, according to this belief, everything you do to others, will be done to you. Every hurt in your life is because you have hurt someone. Every experience is a result of how you have lived in former lives.

This has some pretty amazing ramifications in my opinion. Kind of takes the golden rule to a whole new level!

While I do not believe this in the earthly, religious sense which many devotees embrace, I think it is reflective of a possible essence of the Universe that is one of unity and connection, far beyond what we can grasp. In other words, I think we are not nearly as separate as we seem to think and I think Jesus was on to something when he said, "inasmuch as ye have done it unto the least of these thy sisters, ye have done it unto me."

~td~

[_Inconceivable]

H Inc,

I suppose if we were aware that it was a truth, we may not take our current life so seriously or place such a high value on the lives of others.

Actually, my observation is that those who truly understand and believe in the Karmic model place a very high value on the lives of others and take life quite seriously.

Because, according to this belief, everything you do to others, will be done to you. Every hurt in your life is because you have hurt someone. Every experience is a result of how you have lived in former lives.

This has some pretty amazing ramifications in my opinion. Kind of takes the golden rule to a whole new level!

While I do not believe this in the earthly, religious sense which many devotees embrace, I think it is reflective of a possible essence of the Universe that is one of unity and connection, far beyond what we can grasp. In other words, I think we are not nearly as separate as we seem to think and I think Jesus was on to something when he said, "inasmuch as ye have done it unto the least of these thy sisters, ye have done it unto me."

~td~

That makes sense. You're right. Also, I've never known anyone that claims an NDE that didn't return without placing a higher value upon all living things.

[_Inconceivable]

I think we are not nearly as separate as we seem to think and I think Jesus was on to something when he said, "inasmuch as ye have done it unto the least of these thy sisters, ye have done it unto me."

~td~

I gotta fix this for you, TD. Jesus is noted to have said brethren - I think it's because if you were to compare the genders, the least between the two would undoubtedly be male.

just sayin..

[_Paul Osborne]

Dancer,

Perhaps we danced together on the thoughts of many people who have long since died. I think we are all in this together.

Paul O

[_Paracelsus]

I don't understand the I don't know option.

Can there be people who don't know what they believe?

OK, many of us don't know if there is life after death or isn't.
Really, nobody knows, even many people say they know everything.

Apart from the fact that somebody doesn't know that, one can believe or can not.

I don't know if the well defined pink unicorn exists or doesn't. I don't believe. I know that I don't believe.

Or have I language problem again?