Re: the example thing. I think that is used as a maniupulative tool by the church. Lessons constantly exhort Mormons to be an example because the world is watching them. Leaders tell individuals that they are examples as a way to keep them in line. And members tell each other that their example is important to them as a way to support their own testimonies ... and they do it sincerely 99% of the time, I believe, not realizing that they are conditioned to do it, but it all becomes nothing but a circle of self-aggrandizement in the end.
So, now, I tell people that I was born to be an example ... a bad example. It's important to have bad examples around, right? (smiley here)
Setting an example is not a church thing but a new testament thing. Paul is admonishing the saints to be examples. It all comes from Paul. Also, when one thinks about it, there is nothing wrong in being a positive example for people. There are certainly a lot of bad examples out there that children and teens can follow. And adults too.
I intend to lay a foundation that will revolutionize the whole world. Joseph Smith We are “to feed the hungry, to clothe the naked, to provide for the widow, to dry up the tear of the orphan, to comfort the afflicted, whether in this church, or in any other, or in no church at all…” Joseph Smith
People can usually think themselves away from church but they can't think themselves away from their former testimonies. And perhaps this is why they spend so much time convincing themselves that it is not true and in convincing themselves that they never had a testimony but a warm fuzzy that one can get at a baseball game, as an example.
I intend to lay a foundation that will revolutionize the whole world. Joseph Smith We are “to feed the hungry, to clothe the naked, to provide for the widow, to dry up the tear of the orphan, to comfort the afflicted, whether in this church, or in any other, or in no church at all…” Joseph Smith
why me wrote:People can usually think themselves away from church but they can't think themselves away from their former testimonies. And perhaps this is why they spend so much time convincing themselves that it is not true and in convincing themselves that they never had a testimony but a warm fuzzy that one can get at a baseball game, as an example.
I suppose you would be equally willing to accept that the reverse is also true - people spending a lot of time convincing themselves that their warm fuzzy feeling is a confirmation of the truth and not the same feeling that they and others get at the basketball game.
“We look to not only the spiritual but also the temporal, and we believe that a person who is impoverished temporally cannot blossom spiritually.” Keith McMullin - Counsellor in Presiding Bishopric
"One, two, three...let's go shopping!" Thomas S Monson - Prophet, Seer, Revelator
why me wrote:People can usually think themselves away from church...
Yes, yes they can. Why oh why did God give us the ability to think. It makes it so much harder to believe in Mormonism.
“We look to not only the spiritual but also the temporal, and we believe that a person who is impoverished temporally cannot blossom spiritually.” Keith McMullin - Counsellor in Presiding Bishopric
"One, two, three...let's go shopping!" Thomas S Monson - Prophet, Seer, Revelator
Drifting wrote: I suppose you would be equally willing to accept that the reverse is also true - people spending a lot of time convincing themselves that their warm fuzzy feeling is a confirmation of the truth and not the same feeling that they and others get at the basketball game.
People don't spend much time convincing themselves about whether or not what they felt at church was the spirit. The feeling is usually accepted without question. The same for a confirmation about the truth claim. But the reverse is definitely true for many people.
I intend to lay a foundation that will revolutionize the whole world. Joseph Smith We are “to feed the hungry, to clothe the naked, to provide for the widow, to dry up the tear of the orphan, to comfort the afflicted, whether in this church, or in any other, or in no church at all…” Joseph Smith
Drifting wrote: Yes, yes they can. Why oh why did God give us the ability to think. It makes it so much harder to believe in Mormonism.
People have been leaving Mormonism since its inception. After the conference of june 1831 many left the church eventually. They had problems with Joseph Smith and his behavior or what they understood a prophet should be and act. And quite a few became bitter enemies of the church. They couldn't leave it alone. And it is no different now. People are disappointed in Joseph Smith or in some doctrine. Time hasn't changed our human nature.
I think that what people miss about the LDS church is the absolute knowledge that god lives as confirmed in the Book of Mormon as an appendage to the Bible. That is what many people miss. Now of course, some head to other faiths but even then, there is always this question mark about the LDS church: What if it is true?
I intend to lay a foundation that will revolutionize the whole world. Joseph Smith We are “to feed the hungry, to clothe the naked, to provide for the widow, to dry up the tear of the orphan, to comfort the afflicted, whether in this church, or in any other, or in no church at all…” Joseph Smith
Drifting wrote: Yes, yes they can. Why oh why did God give us the ability to think. It makes it so much harder to believe in Mormonism.
People have been leaving Mormonism since its inception. After the conference of june 1831 many left the church eventually. They had problems with Joseph Smith and his behavior or what they understood a prophet should be and act. And quite a few became bitter enemies of the church. They couldn't leave it alone. And it is no different now. People are disappointed in Joseph Smith or in some doctrine. Time hasn't changed our human nature.
I think that what people miss about the LDS church is the absolute knowledge that god lives as confirmed in the Book of Mormon as an appendage to the Bible. That is what many people miss. Now of course, some head to other faiths but even then, there is always this question mark about the LDS church: What if it is true?
I think the question "what if it is true?" is definitely asked by people who leave the Church, or activity in the Church. But I would suggest that equally the question "what if it isn't true?" is asked by the active members cursed with a brain that likes to think. It is unfortunately a fact that the more people think about the truth claims of Mormonism, the less likely they are to remain believers.
“We look to not only the spiritual but also the temporal, and we believe that a person who is impoverished temporally cannot blossom spiritually.” Keith McMullin - Counsellor in Presiding Bishopric
"One, two, three...let's go shopping!" Thomas S Monson - Prophet, Seer, Revelator
I miss the Young Adult Dances but one need not be Mormon to attend those. I'm just too old. I still go to a Single's Dance occassionally and fight off the fat women to get to the refreshment table to see if there's a piece of cheese left I can munch on while watching old women dance with spastics or old greying men to "Gimme that Old Time Rock and Roll".
I don't miss the boring sermons. I don't miss the ENDLESS old borning priesthood lessons and the same questions over and over again: "Why is it imporant to be a good father?" "Why is it important to be an example to your wife and children?" especially since I had neither.
I DO MISS Sacrament hymns. I think singing those hymns is actually "calming to the soul". Puts you into a nice mellow "mood". DO NOT MISS the rambling in-coherant Sacrament talks, nor the Testimony meeting where everybody sits around waiting for somebody else to stand up and say, "I want to thank my parents and my youth leaders and...yahda yahda...."
I DO MISS seeing all the cute girls at a Young Adult Ward in their Sun dresses and cute bouncing walks. I DO NOT miss most of their personalities or the fact they kept chasing the four or five Don Juans in the Ward all the time.
I DO NOT miss Sunday School where the lessons were always boring, always the same crap, told by the same borning people often reading right out of the Manual.
So, all I miss about Church are the Young Adult Dances, the cute girls at Young Adult Wards, and Sacrament hymn singing. That's about it.
Daheshist wrote:I miss the Young Adult Dances but one need not be Mormon to attend those. I'm just too old. I still go to a Single's Dance occassionally and fight off the fat women to get to the refreshment table to see if there's a piece of cheese left I can munch on while watching old women dance with spastics or old greying men to "Gimme that Old Time Rock and Roll".
babhahaha this is what I did at a lot of dances. I went straight for the cheese!!!
I DO MISS seeing all the cute girls at a Young Adult Ward in their Sun dresses and cute bouncing walks. I DO NOT miss most of their personalities or the fact they kept chasing the four or five Don Juans in the Ward all the time.
cute bouncing walks!! Do LDS girls walk differently than other girls. haha I never noticed.