My First Post (why I'm here and the Gadianton Robbers)

[_Mooseman]

The real problem, Henry, is that you have no clue as to what the gospel really is. I got a dollar for you if you can tell me rightly what THE GOSPEL of Jesus Christ actually is. After I tell you how wrong you are, you will have to wonder how it is you do not know what the gospel of Jesus Christ is having lived in the "true Church" so long. Your turn.

Don't you think this is more relevant than worrying about robbers?
You have been robbed alright and already. You do not even know it oh what you've lost.

[_Sethbag]

I was hoping to discuss the issue of secret combinations. Conspiracy theories. Conspiracy facts. Whatever you want to call them. People here seem to be more interested in discussing whether the Church is true or not. I guess I didn't do the OP the right way. Whether you think the Book of Mormon is true or not, 90% of all of the media that you have access to is owned by 6 corporations. Does that matter?

What exactly do you think is going on? Seriously. "Conspiracy theories" is too vast a topic to discuss meaningfully. What exactly are the theories you are considering?

I tend to think that conspiracy theories are almost certainly imagined, rather than real. Obviously some conspiracies do exist, like the Mafia families or whatever. But most of the conspiracy theories I have heard or read about are just too ridiculous. People can't keep their mouths shut, in reality. Have you ever heard the maxim "two people can keep a secret, as long as one of them is dead?" Now imagine thousands, or tens of thousands, or even millions of people who would have to be in on some of these imagined conspiracies, and yet nobody breaks ranks and uncovers it all? Isn't that just a little too hard to believe?

Anyhow, if you want to talk conspiracies, then name the ones you want to talk about and if it's something anyone here knows or cares about, I'm sure you'll get some discussion.

Oh yeah, and the church isn't really true. If there's a conspiracy behind it, it's a conspiracy to remain ignorant on the part of most of the members.

[_Tim the Enchanter]

Henry, you will find that most of us on this board will have little sympathy for many of your arguments.

I can only speak for myself, but I have sympathy for anyone in Henry's shoes.

A crisis of faith is not like flipping a light switch. It's like fumbling in the dark of an enclosed room searching for something but you don't even know what you are looking for, then you stumble upon a light switch, then you flip it, but then you still can't see because you realize you are also blindfolded, and you've been conditioned all your life to never attempt to untie the blindfold, and when you finally get the courage to do so you find it is tied in some crazy impossible knot, so you work on it a little each day all the while feeling guilty for doing the thing you've been conditioned not to do and you are scared to death of losing your family and your salvation, and when finally you get the knot undone and the blindfold off the light is so blinding it hurts and you wish you could put the blindfold back on, even just a little, because you can't conceive that your eyes will ever adjust to the blinding light, and so you hold the blindfold against your eyes with your hands and let the light in just a crack at a time, then a little more, then a little more, then a little more...

[_ludwigm]

If you are not familiar with the board then a word of warning. The moderation here, by design, allows pretty much anything, with few exceptions.

For example pictures...

[_Bret Ripley]

...let the light in just a crack at a time, then a little more, then a little more, then a little more...

What a great metaphor. Thanks, Tim.

[_Darth J]

I can only speak for myself, but I have sympathy for anyone in Henry's shoes.

A crisis of faith is not like flipping a light switch. It's like fumbling in the dark of an enclosed room searching for something but you don't even know what you are looking for, then you stumble upon a light switch, then you flip it, but then you still can't see because you realize you are also blindfolded, and you've been conditioned all your life to never attempt to untie the blindfold, and when you finally get the courage to do so you find it is tied in some crazy impossible knot, so you work on it a little each day all the while feeling guilty for doing the thing you've been conditioned not to do and you are scared to death of losing your family and your salvation, and when finally you get the knot undone and the blindfold off the light is so blinding it hurts and you wish you could put the blindfold back on, even just a little, because you can't conceive that your eyes will ever adjust to the blinding light, and so you hold the blindfold against your eyes with your hands and let the light in just a crack at a time, then a little more, then a little more, then a little more...

Excellent.

[_Drifting]

I was hoping to discuss the issue of secret combinations. Conspiracy theories. Conspiracy facts. Whatever you want to call them. People here seem to be more interested in discussing whether the Church is true or not. I guess I didn't do the OP the right way. Whether you think the Book of Mormon is true or not, 90% of all of the media that you have access to is owned by 6 corporations. Does that matter?

I find it suspicious that, out of the $6/7 billion that the Corporation of The President receives annually in charitable donations from members, billions of it are being dispersed into loss making commercial ventures designed to spruce up a small part of Salt Lake City whilst very very little ends up in what most reasonable people would term 'charitable' programmes.

I find it suspicious that the organization who publicly declares honesty and truth as specific beliefs, also believes secrecy and misdirection are the appropriate tenets when it comes to financial reporting.

These seem like traits of a secret combination to me.

How about this one: The Church knew that Hoffman had sold them forgeries well before the bomb explosion that was his downfall. Instead of contacting the police promptly so this man could be apprehended. They spent the time inventing ways to cover up the fact that God's prophet on earth had been duped into handing over cash for seemingly genuine artefacts that a couple of atheists and anti Mormons (the Tanners) had already warned them were probably forgeries. (See Dallin Oaks attempt to explain what 'Salamander' really meant). In the interests of saving face, people died.

But you should know by now that the Church isn't a Secret Combination......it's a Sacred one!

[_Dr. Shades]

But most of the conspiracy theories I have heard or read about are just too ridiculous. People can't keep their mouths shut, in reality. Have you ever heard the maxim "two people can keep a secret, as long as one of them is dead?" Now imagine thousands, or tens of thousands, or even millions of people who would have to be in on some of these imagined conspiracies, and yet nobody breaks ranks and uncovers it all? Isn't that just a little too hard to believe?

Or maybe people break ranks all the time, and we call those people "conspiracy theorists," and we don't believe them.

[_Chap]

But most of the conspiracy theories I have heard or read about are just too ridiculous. People can't keep their mouths shut, in reality. Have you ever heard the maxim "two people can keep a secret, as long as one of them is dead?" Now imagine thousands, or tens of thousands, or even millions of people who would have to be in on some of these imagined conspiracies, and yet nobody breaks ranks and uncovers it all? Isn't that just a little too hard to believe?

Or maybe people break ranks all the time, and we call those people "conspiracy theorists," and we don't believe them.

What Shades says is logically possible. In practical terms, however, Sethbag's observations dispose of most of the best-publicized conspiracy theories - such as, for instance "We never landed on the Moon".

[_just me]

What Shades says is logically possible. In practical terms, however, Sethbag's observations dispose of most of the best-publicized conspiracy theories - such as, for instance "We never landed on the Moon".

Or there was never a Jewish Holocaust.