Missionary Age Change - Practical Consequences For Me

[_Harold Lee]

I agree that a male being a Mormon missionary is a right of passage to adulthood.

But I don't think the hajj is a very good example. All kinds of adult Muslim men have never been on the hajj and they are accepted as fully adult males in their community.

In Islam, if there is a definitive adult right of passage, it is more likely to have been adopted from the local culture and thus vary greatly.

The closest Islam comes is circumcision in those communities that delay it until just before puberty, being old enought to fast for Ramadan, and getting married.

There are cultures that circumcise AFTER childhood?

A foreign mission doesn't sound too bad anymore. Most don't pay for it themselves either, mine seems like a long paid vacation now in some ways. Can't say it was a mistake but I'd sure like to have lived life during those two years or gotten a jump start. Threw off 4 years of my life saving, serving, then returning and working to buy a car and basic needs before returning to school. This is common for many kids who can't afford missions but serve anyways, and when it's your early twenties the consequences of losing time like that is more than just time.

The high number of Mormon kids that do well in school has to be disproportionately represented in those that pursue the highest academic and career pursuits that they've earned- I think for a lot of young Mormons that are pressured into a two-year mission, return, and unnecessarily early marriage really throws off potential. You can get married or go proselyting at any point in your life, but you have a short window for making decisions that'll affect the quality of the rest of your life during that time.

If you want to pursue the best programs (which in my experience Mormon kids tend to do comparatively well in school and have earned), it becomes unnecessarily difficult to pursue by putting this pressure on them. It will help the church in retaining BIC Mormon Corridor kids that contribute the most time and money without doubt, but is this the best option for public proselyting? Is this the best for the childrens' futures? That's a decision parents need to make now more than kids.

[_Chap]

I have to say that any young Mormon who is looking to pursue a subject at college level with a high math content after excelling in it at school (I am not just talking competence here, but excellence) will lose a great deal of skill that will be hard to recover during the course of two years 18-20 lost to a mission.

You just can't make up ground like that. Such skills need to be honed every day. I don't say that it is impossible to bounce back from such a setback, but it will never be easy.

[_lulu]

There are cultures that circumcise AFTER childhood?

At 16, "[w]ithout a word, he [the circumcisor] took my foreskin, pulled it forward, and then, in a single motion, brought down his assegai. I felt as if fire was shooting through my veins; the pain was so intense that I buried my chin in my chest. Many seconds seemed to pass before I remembered the cry, and then I recovered and called out, 'Ndiyindoda!' ['I am a man.']

"I looked down and saw a perfect cut, clean and round like a ring. But I felt ashamed because the other boys seemed much stronger and firmer than I had been; they had called out more promptly than I had. I was distressed that I had been disabled, however briefly, by the pain, and I did my best to hide my agony."

-Nelson Mandela

brackets added.

[_Chap]

Is there anyone willing to attempt to argue the case for thinking that this move will not lead to even less baptisms than before? I mean, kids fresh out of High School knocking on doors asking folks to change their religion? Hello?

Bcspace simply indicated that I needed to read the scriptures more. Is that really all there is to say on that side of the argument?

[_Jason Bourne]

I must say that I am so glad three of my four children as adults. My youngest is 17 and is a thinker. She and in have discusse religion a lot. I have encouraged her to read, study and search all sides of things herself and then make her own decisions. She knowsminhace lots of questions and I have shared some in general though not details. My wife does not favor me even discussing such things with my adult kids, which I do anyway.

If the church offered non proselytizing service missions, I would encourage my children to go. They don't, and I never will.

Actually this is not entirely true. For those who may not qualify for a full time proselyting mission for one reason or another local leaders are encouraged to line up service mission opportunities. When I was bishop I got a call from a man who had served in our area with his wife. He had a young man who wanted to serve but because of breaking certain rules a few years earlier could not proselyte. Between me and my SP we designed a unique service mission for him in our area away from his home. He served for two years in our area. He was a wonderful young man. This was a number of years ago. I have a new SP now. Since then we have had a few more such YM serve in our area. We have a bishops storehouse and other Church facilities where they can serve. Plus we put them to work in the community. We have talked about trying to come up with a more formalized process then trying to push it upwards to see if it could happen more formally church wide. The current problem is it is hit and miss.

[_KevinSim]

Aristotle, were you planning on just telling them "the real facts about" LDS history and doctrine, or were you planning on also telling them the real facts about Biblical Christian history and doctrine?

Both.

I'm glad to hear that, Aristotle. I am of the opinion that the problems with Biblical Christian doctrine are far worse than all the problems with LDS history and doctrine combined. So after you've told your children both the problems with LDS history and doctrine and the problems with Biblical Christian history and doctrine, will they conclude that no group has the truth about God? Will they become Buddhists, perhaps?

[_KevinSim]

Dude, what lies are you talking about?

For starters, the LDS scriptures are lies because they purport to be ancient. You know what I'm talking about.

I know precisely what you're talking about. The LDS teaching that they are ancient is indeed controversial. Does that mean that that teaching is a lie?

[_Drifting]

For starters, the LDS scriptures are lies because they purport to be ancient. You know what I'm talking about.

I know precisely what you're talking about. The LDS teaching that they are ancient is indeed controversial. Does that mean that that teaching is a lie?

Yes.
Please see the age of the papyrus upon which Facsimilie 3 resides and compare it with what is declared at the commencement of the Book of Abraham (which includes facsimilie 3).

[_KevinSim]

Yes.
Please see the age of the papyrus upon which Facsimilie 3 resides and compare it with what is declared at the commencement of the Book of Abraham (which includes facsimilie 3).

Are you talking about, "The writings of Abraham while he was in Egypt, called the Book of Abraham, written by his own hand, upon papyrus"? Do you mean to say that it's a lie because the Book of Abraham was actually published by the LDS Church as a book, not written by Abraham's own hand on papyrus? Or in my own case that it was published in electronic form on the Internet? As far as we know Abraham never published anything on the Internet.

[_KevinSim]

Yes.
Please see the age of the papyrus upon which Facsimilie 3 resides and compare it with what is declared at the commencement of the Book of Abraham (which includes facsimilie 3).

Are you talking about, "The writings of Abraham while he was in Egypt, called the Book of Abraham, written by his own hand, upon papyrus"? Do you mean to say that it's a lie because the Book of Abraham was actually published by the LDS Church as a book, not written by Abraham's own hand on papyrus? Or in my own case that it was published in electronic form on the Internet? As far as we know Abraham never published anything on the Internet.

Drifting, were you planning on responding to this?