Historical Mormonism is a mystery cult?

[_LifeOnaPlate]

We could all stand to do more, but man, I have to largely disagree with you on this accusation. It takes a special kind of hatred to overlook the good to this degree.

Hmmm. As special kind of hatred? The figure I heard was something like 3% of Church expenditures going to charitable work. Could be wrong, I suppose, but I assure you that my comment springs from the figure, and not any special kind of hatred.

Agree to disagree.

[_Mercury]

We could all stand to do more, but man, I have to largely disagree with you on this accusation. It takes a special kind of hatred to overlook the good to this degree.

Hmmm. As special kind of hatred? The figure I heard was something like 3% of Church expenditures going to charitable work. Could be wrong, I suppose, but I assure you that my comment springs from the figure, and not any special kind of hatred.

If we go by the specifics provided by stakes in England:

from mormoncurtain:

The LDS Church (UK) Had Reserves Of 257,307,000 Pounds In 2006 And Gave Just 1,264,000 Pounds To Help "The Poor And Needy"

[_LifeOnaPlate]

We could all stand to do more, but man, I have to largely disagree with you on this accusation. It takes a special kind of hatred to overlook the good to this degree.

Hmmm. As special kind of hatred? The figure I heard was something like 3% of Church expenditures going to charitable work. Could be wrong, I suppose, but I assure you that my comment springs from the figure, and not any special kind of hatred.

If we go by the specifics provided by stakes in England:

from mormoncurtain:

The LDS Church (UK) Had Reserves Of 257,307,000 Pounds In 2006 And Gave Just 1,264,000 Pounds To Help "The Poor And Needy"

What source is mormoncurtain citing?

[_Mercury]

What source is mormoncurtain citing?

The governments charatable/religious tax accounting office. These are official numbers FROM the church in the UK. There is no escaping this as reality, LOAP.

[_LifeOnaPlate]

What source is mormoncurtain citing?

The governments charatable/religious tax accounting office. These are official numbers FROM the church in the UK. There is no escaping this as reality, LOAP.

Again, what is the source? Is this from a website, etc.?

[_Mercury]

What source is mormoncurtain citing?

The governments charatable/religious tax accounting office. These are official numbers FROM the church in the UK. There is no escaping this as reality, LOAP.

Again, what is the source? Is this from a website, etc.?

the full article:

Based on the figures in the church's financial statement for 2006 (ref. http://www.charity-commission.gov.uk/...), the LDS Church's "Total resources expended" for 2006 was £28,373,000.

The published value for the church's "Total assets" in the U.K. for the year ending on Dec. 31/06 was £321,359,000 (approx. US$606 million).

The LDS Church (U.K.) spent £705,000 on "Youth conferences" in 2006 and £1,264,000 "for the relief of the poor and needy not only in the United Kingdom and Ireland but also other countries in Europe and Africa."

In 2006, members donated £1,455,000 to the "Fast Offering fund" and £366,000 to the "Humanitarian Aid fund".

The church's senior patriarchal leadership decided to spent only 69.4% of the funds donated by Latter-day Saints in 2006 "for the relief of the poor and needy". The total population of the U.K., Ireland, the rest of Europe and Africa is more than 1.6 billion.

"One out of five Europeans - 93 million people - lives under the poverty line." (ref. http://www.ruralpovertyportal.org/eng...)

"In Sub-Saharan Africa, more than 218 million people live in extreme poverty. Among them are rural poor people in Eastern and Southern Africa, an area that has one of the world's highest concentrations of poor people. The incidence of poverty in Sub-Saharan Africa is increasing faster than the population." (ref. http://sociolingo.wordpress.com/2008/...)

In summary, in 2006 the LDS Church (U.K.) spent less than one-half of one British pence on each impoverished person in Europe and Africa. However, according to its published financial statement for the year, "Closing total shareholders' funds" were £271,786,000 (approx. US$513 million).

According to Matthew 6:19-21 in the New Testament, Jesus preached the following in his Sermon on the Mount:

"Lay not up for yourselves treasures upon earth, where moth and rust doth corrupt, and where thieves break through and steal:

But lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust doth corrupt, and where thieves do not break through nor steal:

For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also."

Clearly, the "heart" of the LDS Church continues to be focused on wealth-accumulation, not alleviating suffering, which is something that Jesus (the man described in stories in the New Testament) was greatly concerned with. Such is the 'spiritual enlightenment' of the 'prophets' who run the multi-billion-dollar, shopping-mall-and-condo-constructing, religious-corporate empire based in SLC.

[_LifeOnaPlate]

From what I understand, local fast offerings go to local people in general. Other offerings are combined into a sum that is spent worldwide. This article seems to be written from a perspective which would say the all the pounds ought to be spent exactly where they are donated. With that line of thinking I disagree. While I believe we could do more, I believe we do a lot more than I realized. Read Bishop Burton's recent conference address.

http://LDS.org/conference/talk/display/ ... 18,00.html

ps- your link appears to be truncated, so it comes up with "page cannot be displayed."

[_Mercury]

From what I understand...

lets stop right there since you seem not to understand ow accounting works. Flowery language and nonspecific bull about theoretical charitable endeavors do not speak well of the Mormon corporation.

Read the article again and think past your conditioning in order to draw logical conclusions based on the numbers instead of jumping to the "all is well in zion" mentality that colors your naïve interpretation of the numbers.

[_Trevor]

What I see here is the Church spending less than what the members contribute specifically for the purpose of helping the poor, toward actually helping the poor. Then I think about the matter more generally. The disparity between the total incoming funds and accumulated wealth combined, and the miniscule outlay for the purposes of charity is staggering. Simply staggering.

Another thought: The LDS Church expects its members to pay over ten percent of their yearly earnings toward tithes and offerings. These members generally work hard for their money, and they pay taxes on what they earn. The LDS Church has money freely pouring in, it does not pay taxes, and yet it seems that this pittance is the best it can do to fulfill one of the most basic commandments of the person whose name it bears.

[_LifeOnaPlate]

From what I understand...

lets stop right there since you seem not to understand ow accounting works. Flowery language and nonspecific bull about theoretical charitable endeavors do not speak well of the Mormon corporation.

Read the article again and think past your conditioning in order to draw logical conclusions based on the numbers instead of jumping to the "all is well in zion" mentality that colors your naïve interpretation of the numbers.

I think you are missing my point. Fast offerings generally stay within the wards and branches in which they are given. There is surplus in many cases, and this money does not line anyone's wallet. It's either used, or will be used. Other donations are distributed by the central organization of the Church as a whole. This money is also either spent on humanitarian efforts or shored up for a rainy day. If for nothing else the Church ought to be commended (indeed, it is, by many people who actually receive aid from the Church) for the humanitarian efforts rather than condemned. I realize you are under the impression that I am some kind of zany "TBM" who believes "all is well in Zion." (To be sure, you're among the last people with whom I would discuss any problems I have regarding the Church.) You appear to hold something of an "all is hell in Zion" mentality. Perhaps I am merely among the last people with whom you would discuss any virtues you see in the Church.