Charles Darwin - Sacred Cause - Abolitionist?

[_EAllusion]

Brigham Young is a monster by comparison

By comparison to what?

In comparison to Darwin. Brigham Young's views on race were far more abhorrent. It's worth noting since we are speaking in the context of Darwin's views being called appallingly racist and you drawing this into an argument by analogy for respecting Young despite his racism. I'm not going to dispute the point of Darwin's racism, but we've then shot one of the stronger words in our rhetorical quiver and can't lose sight of some important distinctions here.

I think the main problem here is that I respect Darwin because he's one of the greatest scientists in human history. While he was a relatively enlightened intellectual for his timeperiod, his views on race or other moral issues have basically nothing to do with why I would even know his name. The respect for Brigham Young, however, is deeply tied into his supposed ability to provide guidance on what people ought to do. His having horrible moral views on one of the most important issues of his day, ugly even relative to his timeperiod, matter more when contemplating his value.

[_Daniel Peterson]

As usual, we disagree.

I'm comfortable with that, and suspect that you are, as well.

[_Chap]

[...]

I think the main problem here is that I respect Darwin because he's one of the greatest scientists in human history. While he was a relatively enlightened intellectual for his timeperiod, his views on race or other moral issues have basically nothing to do with why I would even know his name. The respect for Brigham Young, however, is deeply tied into his supposed ability to provide guidance on what people ought to do. His having horrible moral views on one of the most important issues of his day, ugly even relative to his timeperiod, matter more when contemplating his value.

That's neatly put. A scientist's views on moral questions properly be disagreed with without questioning his status as a competent, or even brilliant scientist. A prophet's views on moral questions, if disagreed with, clearly may count against acceptance of him in his prophetic role, and under some circumstances definitely do count against it.

In fact your point is so unanswerable that I don't think you will find anyone on this board will feel able to object to it on reasoned grounds. See above, for instance.

[_Daniel Peterson]

In a vain attempt to avoid caricatures and straw men: I don't believe that Brigham Young's most unappealing racial views argue for his status as a prophet. I think they count against it. But not decisively so. Nowhere near that.

Were his views "ugly even relative to his timeperiod [sic]"? That hasn't been demonstrated.

[_Chap]

In a vain attempt to avoid caricatures and straw men: I don't believe that Brigham Young's most unappealing racial views argue for his status as a prophet. I think they count against it.

I am delighted to see this point frankly conceded by DCP. I think the fact that he has done so argues for his status as a reasonable man.

But not decisively so. Nowhere near that.

[_Daniel Peterson]

This isn't the first time I've said such a thing, you know. Not even on this specific topic.