Former LDS Believrs, I need your help

[_Dr. Shades]

Wade:

If Mormonism is actually false, how would one go about deciphering that fact?

[_John Larsen]

Here is mine:

1. 130 years of mediocre thought, Western conventional wisdom and self serving bureaucratic nonsense that passes as doctrine.

2. Misogyny, both historical and today, and the use of woman and children as a form of kingdom building.

3. Devotion to the institution above all else which is usually embodied in a cult of personality devotion to its leadership.

4. The entire movement based on the utterly absurd idea of the Great Apostasy.

5. Racism and the doctrinal necessity of American exceptionalism.

6. Mumbo jumbo 19th century science passed off as metaphysics. If Mormonism is correct, than literally every single branch of known science is false to some degree or another.

7. Mormonism requires a belief in a Morality or God that is not understandable by mankind, thus we must be obedient to God's will expressed through his leaders, no matter how indecipherable.

8. The actual history of the leadership of the Church in terms of mistakes and methods makes them indistinguishable from common crackpots and charlatans.

9. For Mormonism to be true, Christianity must also be true. If that weren't enough, an American fundamentalist, literalist interpretation of the Bible is also required.

10. Not only does Mormonism required belief in a God, it is a weird Homo Sapien God--which of course requires the primacy of the Good in and of itself independent of God.

[_Inconceivable]

The intent of this thread is to vet a list of issues and material that were critical to the loss of people's faith.

There's a reason why the robbers never find the cops, Wade - unless their intent is simply to avoid running into them.

[_Mister Scratch]

Dear Wade,

This seems like an interesting project. Unfortunately, there are two reasons why I can't support it.

(1) I don't fit the criteria, since I am not a "former LDS Believr."

(2) I notice that you're using a quote of mine in your sig line. Am I supposed to believe that that will make you seem more sincere? Or, instead, are you trying to communicate to the world that you are a vendetta-fueled apologist, who's just looking to score points?

[_wenglund]

Setting aside for the moment all the snarls, I appreciate those who cooperated with my request. From what I was able to gather, here are the top ten issues:

1. Book of Mormon historicity/authorship
2. Polygamy/Polyandry issues.
3. Revelation (leaders not guided by, members not receiving)
4. Book of Abraham historicity/authorship
5. Blacks and the Priesthood.
6. Church history (white wash, inconsistencies, etc.)
7. Masonry similarities.
8. Doctrinal issues (blood atonement, blood oaths, temple oaths, Mary having sex with God, etc.)
9. Philosophical issues (cruel God, problem of evil, subjectivity, etc.)
10. Patriarchy.

Thanks, -Wade Englund-

[_Chap]

Setting aside for the moment all the snarls, I appreciate those who cooperated with my request. From what I was able to gather, here are the top ten issues:

1. Book of Mormon historicity/authorship
2. Polygamy/Polyandry issues.
3. Revelation (leaders not guided by, members not receiving)
4. Book of Abraham historicity/authorship
5. Blacks and the Priesthood.
6. Church history (white wash, inconsistencies, etc.)
7. Masonry similarities.
8. Doctrinal issues (blood atonement, blood oaths, temple oaths, Mary having sex with God, etc.)
9. Philosophical issues (cruel God, problem of evil, subjectivity, etc.)
10. Patriarchy.

Thanks, -Wade Englund-

He doesn't seem to have taken much of what John Larsen said on board, does he?

Or perhaps "1. 130 years of mediocre thought, Western conventional wisdom and self serving bureaucratic nonsense that passes as doctrine. " is included under "philosophical issues".

[_truth dancer]

Hi Wade,

I think your list is comprised of some examples of a much bigger core issue which is....

Many of the teachings/doctrines/beliefs of Mormonism don't make sense, feel "right", or appear holy/Godly/decent.

In other words, there is too much in Mormonism that goes against ones personal inspiration or intuition of what is "good", too much that doesn't match with ones observations and experience of reality, and too much that seems messy, convoluted, and/or befuddling.



~td~

[_wenglund]

Setting aside for the moment all the snarls, I appreciate those who cooperated with my request. From what I was able to gather, here are the top ten issues:

1. Book of Mormon historicity/authorship
2. Polygamy/Polyandry issues.
3. Revelation (leaders not guided by, members not receiving)
4. Book of Abraham historicity/authorship
5. Blacks and the Priesthood.
6. Church history (white wash, inconsistencies, etc.)
7. Masonry similarities.
8. Doctrinal issues (blood atonement, blood oaths, temple oaths, Mary having sex with God, etc.)
9. Philosophical issues (cruel God, problem of evil, subjectivity, etc.)
10. Patriarchy.

Thanks, -Wade Englund-

He doesn't seem to have taken much of what John Larsen said on board, does he?

His list was given the same weight as the other 25 respondents. Is that a problem?

Thanks, -Wade Englund-

[_wenglund]

Hi Wade,

I think your list is comprised of some examples of a much bigger core issue which is....

Many of the teachings/doctrines/beliefs of Mormonism don't make sense, feel "right", or appear holy/Godly/decent.

In other words, there is too much in Mormonism that goes against ones personal inspiration or intuition of what is "good", too much that doesn't match with ones observations and experience of reality, and too much that seems messy, convoluted, and/or befuddling. ~td~

Doctrinal issues ranked #8 in my survey, so I think you may be projecting here.

But, either way, I got what I came here for, and so for now I bid you all a fond good bye.

Thanks, -Wade Englund-

[_Runtu]

Given Wade's previous thread about how these issues are irrelevant to determining the truth of Mormonism, it will be interesting to see what he does with the information he has gleaned.