Late Anger

[_huckelberry]

Usually, my nightmares involve my past feelings of guilt, in the shadow of men in business suits who look like CEOs of corporations ready to calmly and quietly crush me with a smile.

Zeezrom, that is a well turned phrase. I can not help but sympathize. I think sometimes Ldsfaqs must wish he could accomplish that smile instead of sputtering insults.

[Guest]

-

[_ldsfaqs]

ldsfaqs,

Instead of spouting right wing Mormon nonsense in response to an important issue, why not just explain exactly how a poor family living in a shack with a dirt floor is helped by giving money to the LDS Church that could otherwise be used for food, or medicine, or even some basic education for their children.

If the Church were really following Christ's alleged teachings, it would be out in the world seeking out such people and helping them - not demanding that these people give the Church money they clearly cannot give without harming themselves or their children.

Maybe you don't pay attention, but the Church has MANY humanitarian projects going, most manned by Older Missionary's. Contrary to popular belief, the Church is still a small religion in comparison. It's doing what it can step by step.

[_why me]

My experience is, the attitude and feelings toward Mormonism go in waves. The anger comes around now and then, but then will subside and be replaced with something else. Sometimes disgust, bemusement, apathy, sentimentality, etc.

What are you disgusted about?

If I were you I would be disgusted with all the children priests and nuns abused throughout the years. The catholic church in Ireland is in crisis because of the children that were abused. Now that is disgusting and nothing to be amused about.

[_why me]

I think also (from my own experience) we create monsters-under-the-bed. Fearing leaving or what other might think because we imagine the worst reaction possible. Sometimes what we imagine matches up to reality, other times it doesn't.

Think of the fears former children have now after being abused by priests and nuns. And the nightmares that they have.

I couldn't give a hoot what might think if I left the LDS church. I don't fear or give a hoot now. Who cares what others may think? However, once a child is abused as happened in the catholic church, the fear, guilt lasts a lifetime. I would focus my energies on that and leave the LDS alone.

[_why me]

Maybe you don't pay attention, but the Church has MANY humanitarian projects going, most manned by Older Missionary's. Contrary to popular belief, the Church is still a small religion in comparison. It's doing what it can step by step.

The exmormons here don't care about that at all. Nor do they care that the mall is creating hundreds and hundreds of jobs for those who need them. It is a mute point for the critics who wish to sow anger in members.

[_Kishkumen]

The world is filled with evil. It is everywhere. Did you expect an island where you could go and get away from it? If you like history I suggest reading some history of the American Indians. Read The History of the American Indians by James Adair. It was written in 1775 long before Joseph Smith came along. It just may open your eyes to what modern men have done to our past and to our culture.

I have no doubt the world is full of evil, but is it too much to expect that there be less evil from the organization that claims to have a direct connection with God?

Can't you see that it is exactly like the Jews in Jerusalem? Only in times of trouble did the Jews return to God.

Just because anti-semitism is encouraged in your scripture doesn't mean it is appropriate in dialogue in the real world now.

While I agree with your overall point that anti-Semitic sentiments found their way into Christianity fairly early (late first/early second century CE) and that the ultimate results were horrific, I am not sure that criticizing a certain group of Jews in a certain historical situation is tantamount to a general anti-Semitism. I would hesitate to say so.

We could all point to the Americans or Mormons or Christians who did X and disagree with what they did, but is that anti-Americanism/Mormonism or what have you?

I think not.

Furthermore, your wiki list is highly problematic in its treatment of all Christian books and writers as a unified voice. Many of the teachings this author points to were written by Paul, a Jewish missionary of Christianity, who was involved in sectarian conflict over specific religious issues. He was not an anti-Semite. What is needed is a more nuanced and informed understanding of the texts, not a list of 10 things I, Dr. So-and-so, find troubling on behalf of all Jewish people.

[_Darth J]

I think also (from my own experience) we create monsters-under-the-bed. Fearing leaving or what other might think because we imagine the worst reaction possible. Sometimes what we imagine matches up to reality, other times it doesn't.

Think of the fears former children have now after being abused by priests and nuns. And the nightmares that they have.

I couldn't give a hoot what might think if I left the LDS church. I don't fear or give a hoot now. Who cares what others may think? However, once a child is abused as happened in the catholic church, the fear, guilt lasts a lifetime. I would focus my energies on that and leave the LDS alone.

Yes, Why Me, we can all feel good about ourselves knowing that LDS leaders do not ever use their church positions to sexually molest children.

http://www.ksl.com/?sid=21758748&nid=14 ... id=queue-3

[_Darth J]

Maybe you don't pay attention, but the Church has MANY humanitarian projects going, most manned by Older Missionary's. Contrary to popular belief, the Church is still a small religion in comparison. It's doing what it can step by step.

The exmormons here don't care about that at all. Nor do they care that the mall is creating hundreds and hundreds of jobs for those who need them.

The issue with City Creek and the Church's other business ventures is the proportionality between what it spends on humanitarian aid. This has been discussed many, many times on this board. The Church's own public statements show that its spending on City Creek is a fraction of its spending on two decades' worth of humanitarian aid.

You also have a grand total of nothing to support your assertion about how many jobs the mall is supposedly creating. Retail doesn't really work by just "creating jobs." You have to create demand, too, or those jobs are not going to last long because the stores these people work in won't be bringing in enough revenue to justify their employment.

There is another large upscale mall in downtown Salt Lake City, the Gateway, that City Creek is now competing with. And there are other malls in the valley City Creek is competing with, like Fashion Place (which has Macy's, Nordstrom, and Dillards). Why don't you volunteer an opinion about the dollars that City Creek is taking away from other merchants, or the jobs it may destroy by taking customers away from other venues?

It is a mute point for the critics who wish to sow anger in members.

And thank goodness for those mute points, because some of points have become quite loud lately.

[_Franktalk]

Hasa Diga Eebowai,

Can't you see that it is exactly like the Jews in Jerusalem? Only in times of trouble did the Jews return to God.

I don't know how many Jewish friends you have but try coming out with a question like "Can't you see that it is exactly like the Jews in Jerusalem?" in a negative context and see what reaction you get.

The world is filled with people who take offense. Am I going to avoid speaking because somewhere on this planet someone may take offense? With the wide range of beliefs in the world I doubt one could talk about many subjects without stepping on some toes. What you say offends me so are you going to stop with your posts? What a dumb unrealistic criteria you have. If you are easily offended that is your problem not mine. Don't come to a place where people with different opinions come to argue.

The Bible speaks of the Jews and of God. But they are a pattern of the world and everyone. You really need to find a different argument. This one will not work on me.