If Jesus returns, where will he stay?

[_ozemc]

Charity, can you substantiate your claim? The right to a personal visitation is afforded to anyone, LDS or not, having gone through a particular ritual or not, according to LDS belief. Charity, trying to defend and/or explain your closely held and cherished faith is one thing. Misrepresenting it and spreading misinformation is another.

The Comforter, the Holy Ghost is promised to all, LDS or non-LDS. The Second Comforter is not. Read John 14. It clearly states that any person receiving the Second Comforter must be keepiong all the commandments. Study your scriptures before you make claims of misrepresenting and misinforming, please.

Well, here is John 14. Please tell me where it talks about a "second comforter", unless you think verse 16 is it. Of course, He is talking about the Holy Ghost there, not some "other" comforter, or counselor, as is written in this version.

John 14
Jesus Comforts His Disciples
1"Do not let your hearts be troubled. Trust in God[a]; trust also in me. 2In my Father's house are many rooms; if it were not so, I would have told you. I am going there to prepare a place for you. 3And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come back and take you to be with me that you also may be where I am. 4You know the way to the place where I am going."

Jesus the Way to the Father
5Thomas said to him, "Lord, we don't know where you are going, so how can we know the way?"

6Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me. 7If you really knew me, you would know[b] my Father as well. From now on, you do know him and have seen him."

8Philip said, "Lord, show us the Father and that will be enough for us."

9Jesus answered: "Don't you know me, Philip, even after I have been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, 'Show us the Father'? 10Don't you believe that I am in the Father, and that the Father is in me? The words I say to you are not just my own. Rather, it is the Father, living in me, who is doing his work. 11Believe me when I say that I am in the Father and the Father is in me; or at least believe on the evidence of the miracles themselves. 12I tell you the truth, anyone who has faith in me will do what I have been doing. He will do even greater things than these, because I am going to the Father. 13And I will do whatever you ask in my name, so that the Son may bring glory to the Father. 14You may ask me for anything in my name, and I will do it.

Jesus Promises the Holy Spirit
15"If you love me, you will obey what I command. 16And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Counselor to be with you forever— 17the Spirit of truth. The world cannot accept him, because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him, for he lives with you and will be[c] in you. 18I will not leave you as orphans; I will come to you. 19Before long, the world will not see me anymore, but you will see me. Because I live, you also will live. 20On that day you will realize that I am in my Father, and you are in me, and I am in you. 21Whoever has my commands and obeys them, he is the one who loves me. He who loves me will be loved by my Father, and I too will love him and show myself to him."

22Then Judas (not Judas Iscariot) said, "But, Lord, why do you intend to show yourself to us and not to the world?"

23Jesus replied, "If anyone loves me, he will obey my teaching. My Father will love him, and we will come to him and make our home with him. 24He who does not love me will not obey my teaching. These words you hear are not my own; they belong to the Father who sent me.

25"All this I have spoken while still with you. 26But the Counselor, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you. 27Peace I leave with you; my peace I give you. I do not give to you as the world gives. Do not let your hearts be troubled and do not be afraid.

28"You heard me say, 'I am going away and I am coming back to you.' If you loved me, you would be glad that I am going to the Father, for the Father is greater than I. 29I have told you now before it happens, so that when it does happen you will believe. 30I will not speak with you much longer, for the prince of this world is coming. He has no hold on me, 31but the world must learn that I love the Father and that I do exactly what my Father has commanded me.
"Come now; let us leave.

[_charity]

Charity,

The second comforter is not the same thing as the second annointing, is it?

I think it refers to the same thing. The Second Comforter is Jesus Christ. The Second Anointing would be the ordinance.

t;]
I really don't care what you think. Can you document it? A lot of people think as you do. I did once, as well. But, it doesn't matter what we think, does it?

The term Second Annointing doesn't appear in the scriptures at all. So it really doesn't matter what we think about it. You are right. End of discussion on this topic.

Charity, I spoke directly with someone who has had the second annointing. They did not receive a visit from the Savior.

I don't doubt your word. I am sure someone told you that. I will say again, we don't discuss such sacred things.

[_charity]

Charity, can you substantiate your claim? The right to a personal visitation is afforded to anyone, LDS or not, having gone through a particular ritual or not, according to LDS belief. Charity, trying to defend and/or explain your closely held and cherished faith is one thing. Misrepresenting it and spreading misinformation is another.

The Comforter, the Holy Ghost is promised to all, LDS or non-LDS. The Second Comforter is not. Read John 14. It clearly states that any person receiving the Second Comforter must be keepiong all the commandments. Study your scriptures before you make claims of misrepresenting and misinforming, please.

Well, here is John 14. Please tell me where it talks about a "second comforter", unless you think verse 16 is it. Of course, He is talking about the Holy Ghost there, not some "other" comforter, or counselor, as is written in this version.

The reference in v 17 is that the Comforter being referred to there, which dwells "in" us is the Holy Ghost. Jeuss, as a resurrected being with a physical body, cannot be "in" us.

In v 18, even in your version, the dialogue changes. Whereas in the preceeding verses, Jesus refers to that Comforter in the third person. Then in v 18, Jesus starts speaking in the first person. "I will not leave you. . . I will come to you."

[_ozemc]

Charity, can you substantiate your claim? The right to a personal visitation is afforded to anyone, LDS or not, having gone through a particular ritual or not, according to LDS belief. Charity, trying to defend and/or explain your closely held and cherished faith is one thing. Misrepresenting it and spreading misinformation is another.

The Comforter, the Holy Ghost is promised to all, LDS or non-LDS. The Second Comforter is not. Read John 14. It clearly states that any person receiving the Second Comforter must be keepiong all the commandments. Study your scriptures before you make claims of misrepresenting and misinforming, please.

Well, here is John 14. Please tell me where it talks about a "second comforter", unless you think verse 16 is it. Of course, He is talking about the Holy Ghost there, not some "other" comforter, or counselor, as is written in this version.

The reference in v 17 is that the Comforter being referred to there, which dwells "in" us is the Holy Ghost. Jeuss, as a resurrected being with a physical body, cannot be "in" us.

OK, I don't understand what you mean by this. Do you consider Jesus Himself to be one comforter, and the Holy Ghost a second one (or vice versa)?

In v 18, even in your version, the dialogue changes. Whereas in the preceeding verses, Jesus refers to that Comforter in the third person. Then in v 18, Jesus starts speaking in the first person. "I will not leave you. . . I will come to you."

I think this is refering to the idea that God is one. The Holy Ghost in Jesus, who is one with the Father. He seems to use the ideas interchangeably.

[_the road to hana]

Charity, I spoke directly with someone who has had the second annointing. They did not receive a visit from the Savior.

I don't doubt your word. I am sure someone told you that. I will say again, we don't discuss such sacred things.

You're completely dodging the issue at hand here, Charity.

You made a claim earlier in this thread that those who receive the Second Anointing receive a visitation from the Savior following. It's been demonstrated that that is an unsubstantiated and misleading claim, without merit.

I think you want to rephrase the statement.

If "we don't discuss such sacred things," then why did you? You're actually making this stuff up as you go along.

And for the record, the D&C pretty much spells out most of the ritual involved in the Second Anointing, so it's not all that secret, even from an authorized LDS point of view.

[_SatanWasSetUp]

After posting this I realize it's kindof a dumb question, because before Jesus returns he'll wipe out all the "wicked" which means the only people left will be faithful LDS. So I suppose that limits his lodging options to LDS temples, LDS ward or stake centers, Marriott Hotels, or Utah McMansions. I suppose there won't be any "Motel 6" quality places left for him.

[_charity]

Charity, I spoke directly with someone who has had the second annointing. They did not receive a visit from the Savior.

I don't doubt your word. I am sure someone told you that. I will say again, we don't discuss such sacred things.

You're completely dodging the issue at hand here, Charity.

You made a claim earlier in this thread that those who receive the Second Anointing receive a visitation from the Savior following. It's been demonstrated that that is an unsubstantiated and misleading claim, without merit. I think you want to rephrase the statement.

Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, p. 150

If "we don't discuss such sacred things," then why did you? You're actually making this stuff up as you go along. And for the record, the D&C pretty much spells out most of the ritual involved in the Second Anointing, so it's not all that secret, even from an authorized LDS point of view.

We discuss the doctrine of it. We don't discuss the specific instances when it has occurred. Saying that it is possible to receive a personal visitation from Jesus, is not saying that Person U received such in X place at Y time, and Z are the details of that appearance. Can you tell the difference?

[_the road to hana]

Charity, I spoke directly with someone who has had the second annointing. They did not receive a visit from the Savior.

I don't doubt your word. I am sure someone told you that. I will say again, we don't discuss such sacred things.

You're completely dodging the issue at hand here, Charity.

You made a claim earlier in this thread that those who receive the Second Anointing receive a visitation from the Savior following. It's been demonstrated that that is an unsubstantiated and misleading claim, without merit. I think you want to rephrase the statement.

Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, p. 150

No Charity. The TPJS, p. 150, does not say what you claimed earlier in the thread. Your claim involved a personal visitation to all those who have the Second Anointing following that ritual. The citation from Joseph Smith says something somewhat different.

If "we don't discuss such sacred things," then why did you? You're actually making this stuff up as you go along. And for the record, the D&C pretty much spells out most of the ritual involved in the Second Anointing, so it's not all that secret, even from an authorized LDS point of view.

We discuss the doctrine of it. We don't discuss the specific instances when it has occurred. Saying that it is possible to receive a personal visitation from Jesus, is not saying that Person U received such in X place at Y time, and Z are the details of that appearance. Can you tell the difference?

Yes, I can tell the difference. Apparently you cannot, since that's exactly what I've been saying all along. Possible to receive a personal visitation is something quite different from your original claim.

By the way, just for your information, records on who had or had not received the Second Anointing were available up until about the 1940's, and since that time, are no longer made available. Prior to that time, over 21,000 persons, living and dead, had received the ordinance. And for those who received the ordinance in earlier generations, it was discussed openly and recorded in journal entries.

[_charity]

After posting this I realize it's kindof a dumb question, because before Jesus returns he'll wipe out all the "wicked" which means the only people left will be faithful LDS. So I suppose that limits his lodging options to LDS temples, LDS ward or stake centers, Marriott Hotels, or Utah McMansions. I suppose there won't be any "Motel 6" quality places left for him.

You are so wrong. All the good men of the earth will still be here. That will include a lot of non-LDS.

This idea that only LDS will survive the endtimes destruction is a common lie told about the teachings of the Church to try to make other people misunderstand and hate us.

[_charity]

We discuss the doctrine of it. We don't discuss the specific instances when it has occurred. Saying that it is possible to receive a personal visitation from Jesus, is not saying that Person U received such in X place at Y time, and Z are the details of that appearance. Can you tell the difference?

Yes, I can tell the difference. Apparently you cannot, since that's exactly what I've been saying all along. Possible to receive a personal visitation is something quite different from your original claim.

By the way, just for your information, records on who had or had not received the Second Anointing were available up until about the 1940's, and since that time, are no longer made available. Prior to that time, over 21,000 persons, living and dead, had received the ordinance. And for those who received the ordinance in earlier generations, it was discussed openly and recorded in journal entries.

And evidently you also cannot tell the difference between "did" and "does."