Drifting wrote:If you live in Salt Lake City. This may surprise you, but there is more population outside Salt Lake City than resides within it....
If you were a young person in Africa with no food for you, your wife or your children, would you still feel the same?
This is the crux of this issue: the Brethren live in Salt Lake City, therefore, they are most concerned about Salt Lake City. Their vision does not expand to think globally. They are quite focused in their vision, and Salt Lake City is the apex of that focus. We've seen this for decades, starting the building of the Conference Center... a gift to Salt Lake City residents. The Mall is simply the latest project that uses Church funds to focus on Salt Lake City.
If the Brethren actually bought into the idea of a global church, as opposed to a Salt Lake City church, we would not see projects focused on Salt Lake City. We'd see hospitals in West Virginia, we'd see clinics in southern Texas, we'd see food kitchens on New Mexico reservations. We see none of these things, because not only is the LDS church not a global church, not a global player, we aren't even a player in the war on USA poverty. We are exactly what we look like: upper middle class elitists focused solely on our own gratification.
Yea, us. No doubt God would be proud.
but the church builds temples all around the world. And if you give 10% of your income to Salt Lake City, you can go inside.
"We have taken up arms in defense of our liberty, our property, our wives, and our children; we are determined to preserve them, or die." - Captain Moroni - 'Address to the Inhabitants of Canada' 1775
DarkHelmet wrote:but the church builds temples all around the world. And if you give 10% of your income to Salt Lake City, you can go inside.
None of which generate income. None of which employ maintenance staff (a friend in a neighboring stake missed her grandaughter's softball tournament because her ward was tapped to clean the temple grounds and she felt that was more important than watching a family member). None of which contribute anything to the community... no meeting rooms, nothing.
Yea... temples are a real asset to the communities in which they are built.
(Nevo, Jan 23) And the Melchizedek Priesthood may not have been restored until the summer of 1830, several months after the organization of the Church.
Drifting wrote:If you live in Salt Lake City. This may surprise you, but there is more population outside Salt Lake City than resides within it....
If you were a young person in Africa with no food for you, your wife or your children, would you still feel the same?
This is the crux of this issue: the Brethren live in Salt Lake City, therefore, they are most concerned about Salt Lake City. Their vision does not expand to think globally. They are quite focused in their vision, and Salt Lake City is the apex of that focus. We've seen this for decades, starting the building of the Conference Center... a gift to Salt Lake City residents. The Mall is simply the latest project that uses Church funds to focus on Salt Lake City.
If the Brethren actually bought into the idea of a global church, as opposed to a Salt Lake City church, we would not see projects focused on Salt Lake City. We'd see hospitals in West Virginia, we'd see clinics in southern Texas, we'd see food kitchens on New Mexico reservations. We see none of these things, because not only is the LDS church not a global church, not a global player, we aren't even a player in the war on USA poverty. We are exactly what we look like: upper middle class elitists focused solely on our own gratification.
Yea, us. No doubt God would be proud.
Bravo!! Well said. Too bad whine me can't figure all this stuff out.
It must be those taliban Catholics he's always talking about. It's their fault!!
why me wrote: If I am a senior citizen in need of work, I have a mall to hire me. I say that the church did a wonderful job in providing a place for people to pay taxes and gain dignity.
If not actually hired, senior citizens have an excellent opportunity to volunteer as missionaries, thereby lowering labor costs and at the same time providing service to the Church.
why me wrote: If I am a senior citizen in Salt Lake City in need of work, I have a mall to hire me. I say that the church did a wonderful job in providing a place in Salt Lake City for people to pay taxes and gain dignity.
If I am a senior citizen in Ethiopia I may not see the week out. I see that the Church spent billions on an upmarket shopping mall in Utah but watched whilst millions in Africa lost their dignity scrabbling for food and clean water.
It's abhorrent and Christ is going to ask Monson "why?".
“We look to not only the spiritual but also the temporal, and we believe that a person who is impoverished temporally cannot blossom spiritually.” Keith McMullin - Counsellor in Presiding Bishopric
"One, two, three...let's go shopping!" Thomas S Monson - Prophet, Seer, Revelator
Drifting wrote:It's abhorrent and Christ is going to ask Monson "why?".
There are 14 others who are going to answer the same question, and 14 million others (minus a few) who are going to be asked why they let them do it.
(Nevo, Jan 23) And the Melchizedek Priesthood may not have been restored until the summer of 1830, several months after the organization of the Church.
If you were a young person in Africa with no food for you, your wife or your children, would you still feel the same?
Yes. Africa will always be without food etc...just ask bob geldorf. But there are americans who are working now because of the mall. If the church could make sound investments in africa, they would. The point is: the mall and other property investments provide work for many people. And that is the point. To create a vibrant community where there are jobs to get people to work. Sounds good to me.
Do you honestly NOT see the idiotic logic here? The church this, the church that, if it could do this it would, etc. All that is irrelevant to the claims the church makes concerning God. WHERE is GOD is the only relevant question here. We are told he really does care about his children (all these goonies running around down here on earth you know, us), yet obviously God cares not a whit to even lift a finger to try and help out, and it is THIS reason for why there really will always be starving people in the world, because God is not here. He COULD be, but obviously chooses not to.
Dr CamNC4Me
"Dr. Peterson and his Callithumpian cabal of BYU idiots have been marginalized by their own inevitable irrelevancy defending a fraud."
Philo Sofee wrote:Do you honestly NOT see the idiotic logic here? The church this, the church that, if it could do this it would, etc. All that is irrelevant to the claims the church makes concerning God. WHERE is GOD is the only relevant question here. We are told he really does care about his children (all these goonies running around down here on earth you know, us), yet obviously God cares not a whit to even lift a finger to try and help out, and it is THIS reason for why there really will always be starving people in the world, because God is not here. He COULD be, but obviously chooses not to.
I think it's more likely that the message he's giving to his One True Church leaders is not being received.
(Nevo, Jan 23) And the Melchizedek Priesthood may not have been restored until the summer of 1830, several months after the organization of the Church.
No doubt God would be proud.
