Mickelson Case: GA coverup cont.,

[_Chap]

... f*** ...

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Deep, deep breathing.

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Now read:

RULES FOR THE TERRESTRIAL FORUM AND THE OFF-TOPIC FORUM:


3. Do not use the "F" or "S" words or any of their many variants. Altering the spelling or substituting a symbol for a character does not give you a free pass to disregard this rule.

[_Res Ipsa]

Jersey Girl,

You won't find all the points I listed in the thread. You'd have to read all the exhibits Ron has attached and compare them with his story.

When someone tells a story that has something jarring or out of place in it, you always have to seriously consider the possibility that the memory of the event is faulty. I initially explained the jarring use of the word "promiscuous" like you did. But I also considered it as evidence that the behavior of the daughter that led to the phone call was somehow sexual in nature. It was only after noticing that the phone call was not appearing in documents that I expected it would be mentioned in that I began to seriously consider the possibility that the word "promiscuous" was never used to describe the daughter's behavior in the phone call. After reviewing the recorded conversation between the eldest son and the mother, I realized that it may never have been used by anyone to describe the daughter's behavior at age six, but only the cousin's behavior as a teenager (when she got pregnant). When looked for the first time the phone call was described as using the word "promiscuous" to describe the daughter at age six, I didn't find one until Ron's series of complaints in 2012.

Even trying to take a genuinely skeptical approach to Ron's story, I still failed to give serious consideration to a simple misremembering and followed his story right to "something suspicious is going on with grandpa." Skepticism is hard work.

[_Jersey Girl]

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Chap, It takes all kinds of people using their own forms of expression to make this board work and bring life to the discussions. That's why there is a word censor in place. So long as the word censor is compensating for word usage while still allowing for free speech, I think we all can handle it.

[_Jersey Girl]

I also believe, but am not certain, that the daughter is aware of this thread. I think it should be remembered that she loves her mum and dad and that they should be spoken about with kindness and respect for her sake as much as theirs. It was a hard situation for all of them.

This is an unrealistic and biased expectation.

[_Jersey Girl]

Rather than being detrimental for the daughter, this is cathartic. It's an attempt to right a wrong that has festered in her family for years. She and her father are attempting to publicly shame Lynn Micklesen, because nothing else has worked. He wont admit what he did.

I have some experience and knowledge about the cathartic process and release of emotions. It is my understanding that in order for the victim/patient to experience catharsis, the victim/patient must be the person in control of a situation. She and her father aren't doing anything.

The father is doing it.

And without benefit of therapeutic options for the victim.

What would be incredibly sad in this, is if Ron became the subject on examination rather than Lynn. I think he and his daughter are hoping that if enough people get to know about this case, then it lifts the veil of secrecy and at some point Lynn will admit and apologise. He'll put his grandaughter before his church position and reputation. In that, I don't hold out much hope.

They can hold out a hope until the cows come home. The expectation or hope that the alleged pedophile is going to confess, repent and/or apologize is unrealistic. For example, you discuss that they're hoping that if enough people get to know about this case, that it lifts the veil of secrecy.

Do they really expect the alleged pedophile to cave based on the opinions of total strangers?

It's not going to happen.

[_Chap]

Chap, It takes all kinds of people using their own forms of expression to make this board work and bring life to the discussions. That's why there is a word censor in place. So long as the word censor is compensating for word usage while still allowing for free speech, I think we all can handle it.

... f*** ...

... s***...

...

RULES FOR THE TERRESTRIAL FORUM AND THE OFF-TOPIC FORUM:


3. Do not use the "F" or "S" words or any of their many variants. Altering the spelling or substituting a symbol for a character does not give you a free pass to disregard this rule.

I note that you did not quote my citation of the rules laid down for this forum. You're OK with ignoring them?

One function that rule 3 serves is to stop people using obscenity as a substitute for argument, and as a cheap content-free 'sincerity signaller' - "Look, I'm swearing, so I must be a really sincere and genuine person, and a regular stand-up sorta guy (or gal)".

That kind of thing makes the board less interesting rather than more.

[_Jersey Girl]

I note that you did not quote my citation of the rules laid down for this forum. You're OK with ignoring them?

Chap,

I didn't quote the citation of the board rules because I'm trying to do what Shades asked me to and avoid "wholesale copying" of posts for response. My comment regarding the word censor was based on those very same rules where it discusses not taking measures to override the word censor. The word censor does the job it was intended to do. I think Shades believes it to be adequate.

[_Jersey Girl]

Hey Chap,

Didja want to cover this post with an admonishment, too? Mary stop being sincere.

To anyone who disagrees that I should link to snippets. I did it because that is what K wants, and I don't give a flying f*** about those who think they are doing what's best for her. She wants it out there. She wants it known. It's her life, and her story. She's an adult and she knows what is best for her. Not you.

If however under the rules of the board, Shades would like me to delete her name, then I will.

You, too, Chap.

I have to say that if we are to talk about credibility, then the mother's failure to contest the husband's claim for custody of the children in a state where a Mormon mother is (is she not?) very, very likely to be awarded custody if she seeks it, looks to me like a great, big, flashing buzzing "WTF"?.

It's very strange, whatever else it is.

[_Res Ipsa]

I am happy to stand alone in this. Look, from my viewpoint RI has consistently looked at the same evidence I have, reading into it the worst of the father, and myself the best.

Mary, I think that is an unfair description of what I have done with the evidence. What I have done is taken the story Ron tells us today and compared it with the evidence that he has chosen to share with us. I've looked at that evidence two ways: First, the order of events regardless of when they were reported. Second, the order in which events were reported and described. What I've found is that Ron's story today diverges from what the evidence says in several significant instances. Now, I suppose I could say "well, I believe Ron, so I can invent explanations for the contradictions." Or you could say "I trust evidence that was created closest to the time of the events." If you do the latter, then you try to reconcile people's recollections of those events in a way that is consistent with the evidence. Given our understand of how memory works and how inaccurate and distorted memories can be, contemporaneous evidence is on the whole much, much closer to the truth of what actually occurred.

[_AmyJo]

I personally feel that Mr. Karran is out to publicly shame and put in a bad light his ex-father in law and the Mormon church. His daughter may have given her consent with her blessing. But it seems to be more dad's catharsis than hers.

I have more catharsis going shopping on a rainy day. If it helps him and her to heal I'm all for it.

Otherwise, just getting it in print to air out every piece of dirty laundry probably isn't going to convey a meaningful message if what we're left with is someone else's dirty linen.

As for Ron's publishing it online via social network format on the lifeaftermormonism and Facebook sites where it is getting a wide array of reception and thousands of reads; it is what he wanted all along. That accomplishes his goal without needing to pay a publisher to print it in book form. And who reads books today anyway, given the free flow of ideas online via social networks?

He accomplished what he has set out to do. I give him credit for that. I still feel he and his daughter still need to work on their recovery. He, from his ugly and painful divorce. And she from that which led to her being isolated and basically cut-off from her mother's side of their family. There is still time for daughter and mother to heal their relationship if that's what they both would love to be able to do.

It will only make it harder for them to do that if acrimony continues between her father and mother.

Time for a truce between the parents, in other words. Forgive each other their shortcomings and imperfections. Do *not* forgive gramps for what happened when K was a child. Give responsibility its due. He is accountable for what transpired back when. Ron is also responsible for his actions and reactions to the family drama.

The Mormon church is not high on a hill shining a beacon of light for all to see. It has done some pretty awful things and covered up its own transgressions while shaming others who do not buy its religion wholesale. Ron has done a good deed to shine a light into an ugly corner of its closet.

I'd say he has accomplished his mission rather well.

Now he needs to focus on the present, on healing, and look with hope to the future. He still has these incredible children of his to be thankful for, and what's ahead rather than the rear view mirror.

:)