Rules of Patheos: Midgley appears to violate TOS 10x

[_moksha]

Hang in there Moksha. Your comments, whether here or there, are so much fun to read! Thank you.

Thank you, Lemmie. When we are shut in by the coronavirus, it is nice to read kind words online.

[_I have a question]

an interesting post from reddit, titled the successor, has an opinion on why the hosanna shout was done this conference:

President Nelson got taken down a step in October 1990 when, in answer to his talk about the correct name of the Church, President Hinckley recited a humorous verse: “ Father calls me William, Sister calls me Will, Mother calls me Willie, But the fellers call me Bill”

That must have stewed in President Nelson for a while. It would not have receded when President Hinckley overlooked him for a counsellor when selecting the more junior Henry Eyring, less than 6 months before President Hinckley died. But redemption ultimately came recently when he got to call out “Mormonism” as being of the devil and wiped it from the Church idiom, for the present.

President Hinckley read the last two Proclamations to the Church, in 1980 and 1995, and now President Nelson has done that. He read from the Sacred Grove an updated and improved version of the 1980 sesquicentennial proclamation read from the Whitmer home by President Hinckley. Perhaps it was 10 years earlier than appropriate, but would President Nelson still be around in 2030?

President Hinckley did the previous Hosanna Shout at the opening of the Conference Centre 20 years ago, with more than 20,000 members. President Nelson followed the same pattern of instruction and performed the Hosanna Shout, planned to be with about 21,000 members but in fact only about 5 were present due to the coronavirus, one of whom couldn’t manage to wave the handkerchief in unison.

In 1996 President Hinckley changed the logo of the Church to emphasise the importance of the Savior. In 2020 President Nelson changed the logo to put added emphasis on the Savior.

Shortly before President Hinckley was called into the First Presidency, the Sunday block meeting program was instituted. President Nelson has eliminated one of the three hours of meetings, thus substantially changing and shortening that block meeting program.

Are the things done by or associated with President Hinckley a guide to the next reform of President Nelson?
https://www.reddit.com/r/Mormon/comment ... successor/

That's a great insight.

[_moksha]

It was just a day. Nothing special. You know? No hint, no warning. Just BAM! Mormon Crickets and Louis Midgley.
-- Mormon Pioneer Journal, 1847

[_Dr. Shades]

Is Nelson the first known case of someone being infected with HIENVID-18? (Hinckley Envy Virus Disease 2018)

So, are you implying that President Nelson is suffering from a case of. . . Hincklenvy?

[_I have a question]

Is Nelson the first known case of someone being infected with HIENVID-18? (Hinckley Envy Virus Disease 2018)

So, are you implying that President Nelson is suffering from a case of. . . Hincklenvy?

I believe it is strand of the gordonavirus family called Henvid -19

[_Lemmie]

Midgley, being the bully and liar that he is, makes up another round of disparagement about gemli:

Discussion on Sic et Non 33 comments
“Ultimate Questions”

Louis Midgley
Louis Midgley 3 hours ago

gemli: "I know that God doesn't exist in the same way I know that Thor, Odin and Baal don't exist, or that faeries, goblins, elves, sprites, Leprechauns, ghouls, demons and poltergeist don't exist."

Please notice that gemli rejects ghouls, elves and so forth for exactly the same reason that he rejects physics. One cannot touch with the one's hands or see with one's eyes what those competent in physics are talking about because it is only known through mathematics.

Once he was going to be a real scientist by mastering physics, but his inability to control the math involved put an end to his longing for an academic career way back almost to when he was still deeply in thrall to what those Nuns had indoctrinated him in that Roman Catholic school to which his parents sent him in an effort to get some of the wiggles out of him.

Keep in mind that now and then gemli will boast about his spirituality which might entail his own muddled faint memories of his Roman Catholic indoctrination. But one can be certain that gemli has given Thor, Leprechauns, ghouls, goblins and so forth exactly the attention that he has to the actual contents of the faith of Latter-day Saints or any of his targets--that is, exactly none.

And he has also made exactly no contribution to any actual science. And he despises history, and hates philosophy. But he worships science in the abstract. gemli has never had a question, ultimate or otherwise. His scientism makes it unnecessary to have questions.

https://www.patheos.com/blogs/danpeters ... 4882244731

It’s been said and proven a thousand times, but in support of gemli, once again I will note what a mean-spirited ass the Midgefly is. Gemli deserves to be sainted for his tolerance of this unrelenting assault that Peterson allows on his blog, in full defiance of Patheos rules. Not to mention his religion. Whatever issues I have with the lds church, I grew up knowing that ongoing bullying such as Midgley’s was dead wrong. From an adult? It is a grievous sin.

[_Lemmie]

Last month, I posted an objection to Midgley calling Maori Mormons “primitive believers”:

Men like him only like Lamanites as long as they keep their place. As soon as they have the ability to challenge them it makes them very uncomfortable. This was apparent in ways he was addressing me.

I'm sure he loves the Maori, as long as they support his beliefs, and they continue to be a faith promoting mascot. With the Maori he has been able to match some parallels between Maori folklore with that of LDS folklore....

I think you have defined it exactly, Dr LOD. ”Keeping their place” especially seems to define his disdain for Gina Colvin. A number of times he has defined her life before she left the lds church with approval, when she was apparently “keeping her place” as a Maori-born Latter-day Saint. Using his exact words, he said she was a “naïve primitive believer.”

Dear god. What is Midgley thinking, describing Maori people in his religion as “naïve” and “primitive”?

Midgley apparently noticed my issue with his wording, as he has posted this unconvincing and rather illogical explanation:

Our dear friend Davis Bitton went through an unfaithful phase, and then faced a real crisis, he made the choice to become a "primitive believer." I don't think that he would object to that description of his transformation....

Recently our little Latter-day Saint group were taken to a famous Maori center in Rotorua where we were then "entertained" by Maori who explained some of their traditional ways. At one point they started singing in Maori, and I suddenly joined in. Our little Latter-day Saint group noticed that I knew those wonderful Maori words. They asked me how I knew those words, and I was at a loss to explain how I did. I was suddenly back in 1950 when I entered a charmed world of "primitive believers" for wonderful moment. For a moment I was again one of them.

I know that I have been very heavily impacted by the skepticism about divine things that is the dominant heritage of the Enlightenment. But I was also raised in and then also came to know a charmed world. For those even a bit open to divine things, the natural world is a wonder and a delight. I like to use the expression "primitive believer" for those of such a disposition.

https://www.patheos.com/blogs/danpeters ... 4884162777

?? Curiously, three different times in this disconnected and incongruous explanation, Midgley puts “primitive believer” into quotes.

A few years back, an article in the New Zealand Herald dealt sharply with the use of the word primitive in describing Maori people:

A blog post that used a picture of a kapa haka group and called Maori culture "primitive" shows a narrow-minded and ignorant world view, the kapa haka group's leader says.

...The kapa haka post said primitivism "represents an early phase of human development, long before mankind had achieved civilisation. Primitivism is not preferable to civilisation ... Civilisation has elevated our minds and refined our nature; primitivism bears the stamp of our lowly origins.“

... Race Relations Commissioner Dame Susan Devoy said the post showed that "Maori New Zealanders continue to face racism, intolerance and ignorance today".

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/resizer/zh3n ... SBBUDQ.jpg

Rather than trying to justify defining Maori Mormons as “primitive believers,” perhaps Midgley should just quit using the term.

[_moksha]

LDS Sacrament Meeting in New Zealand

Just because Dr. Midgley refers to someone's primitive belief does not mean he is necessarily being insulting. He could just be referring to Brigham Young era behaviors and values.

[_Dr LOD]

The 34 pages of Midgley quotes in this thread say otherwise, Peterson.

Midgley is indeed a bully, and it is copiously documented in his own words here. He is a foul-mouthed, mean-spirited, obsessive bully, and he tells increasingly complicated lies about those he is compulsively attacking. Peterson facilitates this behavior, and together they represent a pretty obnoxious picture of online LDS behavior, brought to the world by two BYU professors. Shameful.

Hang in there Moksha. Your comments, whether here or there, are so much fun to read! Thank you.

Midgley actually uses his "defending the Saints" superhero narrative to justify his own immoral behavior. Doing a bit of a mental rewind of myself to a time when I was TBM, I really couldn't see coming to a different conclusion than how I see his behavior today.

[_Doctor CamNC4Me]

This is an interesting bit:

“Davis Bitton wrote, and we published it in the old FARMS Review, a scathing review of an essay by Davis Bitton on Mormon Intellectuals. This was his way of, in public and for all to see, that he had turned his back on what he once was. His mighty change of heart came when his marriage fell apart. He was devastated. He told me that at that moment he had to ask himself what did he really believe and exactly what ought to guide him henceforth.

He remarried, and at his funeral there was no mention at all of his having helped to found the Mormon History Association and Dialogue, but a lot of talk about how he loved the FARMS Review and Fair Mormon. He also truly loved his time as Assistant Church Historian, even though he was the odd one out at that time.

I spent many hours gabbing with Davis, sometimes in person, and sometimes for hours on the phone. We both wrote an essay together. His wife insisted that his name could not go on that essay. So we fashioned a fake name for it, which I believe has been sort of fixed. I am pleased to have been its co-author with Davis Bitton.”

What I find curious about this confession is two-fold.

1) How easily Louis succumbs to duplicity.

2) How easily he has no regard for family members and their wishes. Bitton’s wife didn’t want her husband’s name on that essay, and instead of respecting her and their marriage, Louis undermines her by getting Bitton to use a nom de plume.

Unbelievable.

- Doc