Book of Mormon authorship project is online

[_marg]

Off hand can someone tell me how many years it is estimated Sidney Rigdon worked on writing the Book of Mormon from start until it was published? And given the length of time wouldn 't that rule out "automatic writing" being part of the process?

Edit: One of the reasons I'm interested in time frame is I just listened to a talk by Malcolm Gladwell (author of Tipping Point) and he mentioned that studies have found that on average to become accomplished or to create accomplished works takes on average about 10 years @ 4 hrs/day or 10,000 hours.

[Bedlamite]

...
What drives you?

Jersey Girl

I love the RLDS people and I love the Reorganized Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints.
In many ways they come the closest, in my experience, to the original followers of Jesus.

But you cannot build truth upon a lie.

So long as the RLDS (and the apostate CoC) continue to teach that Joseph Smith
was not a polygamist, and that Nephites were not fictional, they are living,
promoting, publishing and teaching their children a pack of self-defeating lies.

If these people would, just once, summon up the courage to face their past, they might
actually become the Saints they proclaim themselves to be in these latter days.

A great deal of Christianity is permeated with myths and founded upon half-truths. If
the Latter Day Saints could admit the deceptions and false doctrines of their past,
and move on, building upon what is truly good among them, they might even present
themselves as a good model for the Christians to follow, in examining their own past.

I continue to hope.

Dale R. Broadhurst
web-host SidneyRigdon.com

[_AlmaBound]

Do these maps work or not work for the Book of Mormon? Would someone like to refute or support the images and the theory behind them that whoever authored the Book of Mormon, drew from real geographical locations in the area represented.

Speculation time: I think the location for Zarahemla "moved" during the course of the writing of the book, from Grand Island to Palmyra, based on an alternative interpretation of King Noah found in the Book of Mosiah.

One thing I did find interesting was that the location Holley identifies for "Ramah" corresponds to an Indian Reservation, and did during the early 1800s as well.

[_Uncle Dale]

Off hand can someone tell me how many years it is estimated Sidney Rigdon worked on writing the Book of Mormon from start until it was published? And given the length of time wouldn 't that rule out "automatic writing" being part of the process?

I can only give some guesses -- but here goes:

1812-1816 -- Rigdon first encounters Spalding's writing and perhaps copies part of them
1816-1822 -- Rigdon is mostly away from the Pittsburgh area
1822-1823 -- Elder Winters sees the Spalding manuscript in Rigdon's possession
1823-1824 -- Rigdon publishes "3rd Epistle of Peter;" devotes himself to scriptural study
1824-1825 -- Rigdon meets the Smith family; begins to edit Spalding's writings
1826-1827 -- Rigdon and 1 or 2 others inject "revelation" into Spalding's writings
1827-1828 -- Second redaction of the Book of Mormon in OH/PA
1828-1829 -- Book of Mormon text is finalized in PA/NY

In my guess, we have Rigdon adding to (or correcting) Spalding's story in 1824-25; but
not engaging in massive hypographia until after his move to Ohio at the end of 1825.

The "channeling of spirit voices" would have mostly occurred in 1826, with additions
from Rigdon in 1828, and additions by Cowdery/Smith in 1828-29.

The "spirit writing" could have been of two types ---- (1) a continual, manic, stream of
conscious (or better, unconscious) writing done in 1826; followed by (2) more limited,
"Ouija board" style additions. How such activity might have been coordinated and given
some semblance of an organized compositional process, I do not know.

UD

[_marg]

The "spirit writing" could have been of two types ....

Why even assume any sort of "spirit writing, stream of consciousness writing" etc when he had such a massive amount of time to work on it?

[_Uncle Dale]

The "spirit writing" could have been of two types ....

Why even assume any sort of "spirit writing, stream of consciousness writing" etc when he had such a massive amount of time to work on it?

I developed this theory in tandem with my reading of Carl M. Brewster's paper on Rigdon



The Rigdons' nursemaid left other recollections of the "spirit writing" that went on in the Rigdon cabin, at Bainbridge, Ohio,
in 1826, but we would have to consult Dr. Brewster's original manuscript in Pullman, Washington for the details. After
considering the "automatic writing" thesis, I checked with Craig Criddle, to see what he knew about Rigdon's head injuries,
temporal lobe epilepsy, Ellen White's head injury and her spirit writing, etc.

The picture that came together, when the hypographia phenomenon was coupled with Rigdon's brother's report of
Sidney's activities after his youthful head injury, led me to suspect that Rigdon believed he was channeling spirit voices.
An examination of his many post-Nauvoo revelations confirmed that opinion in my mind.

What I do not know, is whether or not Rigdon experienced any lucid episodes, when he fully realized that his visions
and radical interpretations of biblical prophecy were delusions. I think that perhaps he did. If so, he must have lived
a Jekyll-and-Hyde religious life, compartmentalizing his irrational episodes from his more sane periods.

I also do not know how much of Rigdon's "revelations" came as an uninterrupted flow from his altered state of
consciousness, and how much was studied, calculated and refined through proof-reading and correcting. Perhaps a
closer study of his post-Nauvoo writings may shed some light on that mystery.

Again, I do not know how much of an influence Rigdon had upon Cowdery and Smith. I do not picture them as having
delusional episodes where they engaged in massive hypographia. I picture them as emulating Rigdon's literary output
in briefer, more controlled ways -- similar to Smith's reception of "revelations," in which he began talking, and a scribe
wrote down what he was saying, until he came to some logical end-point. In doing this, was Smith emulating Rigdon
(or perhaps the Prophet Jacob Cochran?) or did Rigdon produce his revelations in some entirely different manner?

I do not know -- but I doubt that much of what Rigdon produced was done in a cold, calculated way. I think he truly
believed that Nephite spirits were communicating to the world through his manic penmanship.

Now -- how do I go about locating some better documentary confirmation of my "theory"???

UD

[_Dr. Shades]

I do not know -- but I doubt that much of what Rigdon produced was done in a cold, calculated way. I think he truly
believed that Nephite spirits were communicating to the world through his manic penmanship.

I have to admit, your theory certainly explains the mysterious passage in II Nephi 26:16:

"For those who shall be destroyed shall speak unto them out of the ground, and their speech shall be low out of the dust, and their voice shall be as one that hath a familiar spirit; for the Lord God will give unto him power, that he may whisper concerning them, even as it were out of the ground; and their speech shall whisper out of the dust."

It also handily explains Moroni 10:27:

"And I exhort you to remember these things; for the time speedily cometh that ye shall know that I lie not, for ye shall see me at the bar of God; and the Lord God will say unto you: Did I not declare my words unto you, which were written by this man, like as one crying from the dead, yea, even as one speaking out of the dust?"

So, props to you, Dale!

.

[_Uncle Dale]

I do not know -- but I doubt that much of what Rigdon produced was done in a cold, calculated way. I think he truly
believed that Nephite spirits were communicating to the world through his manic penmanship.

I have to admit, your theory certainly explains the mysterious passage in II Nephi 26:16:

"For those who shall be destroyed shall speak unto them out of the ground, and their speech shall be low out of the dust, and their voice shall be as one that hath a familiar spirit; for the Lord God will give unto him power, that he may whisper concerning them, even as it were out of the ground; and their speech shall whisper out of the dust."

It also handily explains Moroni 10:27:

"And I exhort you to remember these things; for the time speedily cometh that ye shall know that I lie not, for ye shall see me at the bar of God; and the Lord God will say unto you: Did I not declare my words unto you, which were written by this man, like as one crying from the dead, yea, even as one speaking out of the dust?"

So, props to you, Dale!

.

The Nephi quote is actually reproduced from Isaiah -- though we ought to stop and ask ourselves just
why it was that Nephi thought the words of Isaiah were so appropriate for inclusion in the "record."

Rigdon's post-Nauvoo revelations show this same pattern -- of departed scriptural personages
speaking through him. And yet, I do not think Rigdon was totally comfortable with the role of seer;
he was more inclined to function as an orator than an oracle.

UD

[_ByronMarchant]

Not meaning to stray off the current sub topic, but I'm afraid my time will be more limited in the coming week and I wanted to cover these maps created by Vernal Holley. If anyone objects, I'll create a new thread for this however, I was hoping to confine all of the material regarding authorship to this one thread for reference.

Do these maps work or not work for the Book of Mormon? Would someone like to refute or support the images and the theory behind them that whoever authored the Book of Mormon, drew from real geographical locations in the area represented.

If they don't work to support that theory, please state "how" they fail.

Before I made my own Great Lakes Book of Mormon map (included in other, earlier, posts here), I had looked at Vern Holley's and discussed the matter with him; then I met Delbert Curtis and discussed his views with him.

It occurred to me that they, though coming from entirely different directions, were each correct in their own way.

I believe that Holley's strength is not in his map ideas but in his list of similar names (Book of Mormon and Spalding Contemporary NY and PA locations). Although I do not agree entirely with Curtis' map locations, I became convinced that he was onto something and then, by using his research and views, drew my map (self published in 1994). Holley never argued with me and when he died a few years later, although he did not come right out and admit it, I had the impression that he agreed with me. By then he was onto other things and we (me, Vern and his wife) remained on very friendly terms.

Byron

[_Dwight Frye]

I don't want to pony up the $28 to read this thing, but I am curious as to what it has to say about the Hilton/Berkley wordprint study. Any of you good fellows mind doing some copying and pasting or passing on a brief summary? Thanks kindly.



(And if this has already been addressed somewhere in these past thirty-something pages, just let me know, and I'll go digging. Thanks!)